tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5516627478339613810.post4573479362200419066..comments2023-11-02T03:10:39.674-07:00Comments on GeeeeeZ!: What we did in Japan draws a line...............Zhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/15989573357446569262noreply@blogger.comBlogger50125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5516627478339613810.post-45159315399758977572009-05-08T18:17:00.000-07:002009-05-08T18:17:00.000-07:00Were you caught by surprise at Pearl Harbor in 194...Were you caught by surprise at Pearl Harbor in 1941?<br /><br />Evidence exists that there were prior indications of an attack by the Japanese on our military forces there. But, contrary to what rightwing sites may tell you, the hard evidence is that no warning was given before the atomic bombing of the city of Hiroshima.<br /><br />The evidence used to support nuking Nagasaki is easily refuted.<br /><br />You might say the Japanese had plenty of warning because the atomic bomb was described and predicted by H.G. Wells in a novel published in 1914.<br /><br />However, three things should be understood:<br /><br />1) Even if contrary to fact proper prior warning had been given, the position that dropping atomic bombs on cities is an immoral act, is nonetheless tenable.<br /><br />2) One immoral act does not excuse another. (bin Laden tried to use what we did to Hiroshima and Nagasaki to excuse 9/11.)<br /><br />3) Moral judgment is personal opinion not logical deduction from any set of empirical facts.<br /><br />I say it’s patriotic to not betray America’s ideals and values. Upholding them, we do not err.<br /><br />Thanks (for not deleting my dissenting comments).psi bondhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16900724279414147038noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5516627478339613810.post-74607730692048669132009-05-08T10:49:00.000-07:002009-05-08T10:49:00.000-07:00Damn, I wish we'd had a warning at Pearl Harbor......Damn, I wish we'd had a warning at Pearl Harbor...so much more humane.<br /><br />By the way, there is good information on both sides of the issue; very substantial information pro and con the atom bomb on Nagasaki.<br /><br />I say it's pathetic to choose to err on ....another's side. Again.<br /><br />Thanks.Zhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15989573357446569262noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5516627478339613810.post-84589567766770120252009-05-07T22:39:00.000-07:002009-05-07T22:39:00.000-07:00Elmers Brother: but Stewart doesn't ask if the war...Elmers Brother: <I>but Stewart doesn't ask if the warning was adequate he doesn't realize there was a warning at all.</I> <br /><br />It’s likely the reason “he doesn't realize there was a warning” is that the documented fact is it was decided at the highest level that no warning should be given to the Japanese. But, if contrary to what we know, prior warning of an atomic attack had been authorized, it most likely would have been inadequate to the unprecedented weapon faced by the people of Hiroshima (as well as Nagasaki).psi bondhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16900724279414147038noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5516627478339613810.post-36067939350352457212009-05-07T10:03:00.000-07:002009-05-07T10:03:00.000-07:00but Stewart doesn't ask if the warning was adequat...but Stewart doesn't ask if the warning was adequate he doesn't realize there was a warning at all.elmers brotherhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03382038085149828957noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5516627478339613810.post-60685607637316108612009-05-07T08:42:00.000-07:002009-05-07T08:42:00.000-07:00This comment has been removed by the author.elmers brotherhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03382038085149828957noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5516627478339613810.post-74167817073284834222009-05-07T02:08:00.000-07:002009-05-07T02:08:00.000-07:00Elmers Brother: for e.g. Stewart felt Truman a wa...Elmers Brother: <I> for e.g. Stewart felt Truman a war criminal (a moral judgement) because he thought there was no warning. </I> <br /><br />Thanks for explaining yourself, but it may not be so simple. Was the purported warning adequate? Did it explain that bomb shelters, ducking and covering, and firebreaks would be of no avail against the atomic bomb <I>Little Boy</I> that was about to be dropped on Hiroshima? Were the people warned of when the attack would take place so as to have adequate time to evacuate a large city? Jon Stewart could be correct insofar as the people may have been given a proper warning for an unprecedented atomic attack. Nonetheless, regardless of whether the alleged warning was considered sufficient, Stewart may have been right in his moral judgment if the definition of a war criminal is understood to be one who wreaks or is responsible for immense deadly harm in wartime on a defenseless civilian population.<br /><br />The hisrorical fact is that, in a meeting held June 1, 1945. the Interim Committee, a secret high-level group created in May 1945 by Secretary of War Henry L. Stimson with the approval of Truman, which was tasked with making recommendations concerning the use of the atomic bomb, the view that the Japanese should not be given prior warning of an atomic attack was adopted.<br /><br />Wikipedia states: “Although the United States had previously dropped leaflets warning civilians of air raids on twelve other Japanese cities, the residents of Hiroshima were given no notice of the atomic bomb.”psi bondhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16900724279414147038noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5516627478339613810.post-8326871229613967012009-05-07T02:06:00.000-07:002009-05-07T02:06:00.000-07:00Elmers Brother: but the dumbass lefty comedians ...Elmers Brother: <I> but the dumbass lefty comedians morality it based on his flawed view of history. </I> <br /><br />What is a flawed version of history? That high-handed decree represents one’s personal interpretation of someone else’s view of history.psi bondhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16900724279414147038noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5516627478339613810.post-22723558580918190632009-05-06T18:37:00.000-07:002009-05-06T18:37:00.000-07:00for e.g. Stewart felt Truman a war criminal (a mor...for e.g. Stewart felt Truman a war criminal (a moral judgement) because he thought there was no warning.elmers brotherhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03382038085149828957noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5516627478339613810.post-40773327213873885882009-05-06T17:13:00.000-07:002009-05-06T17:13:00.000-07:00Elmers Brother: hmmmm the only loser in the video ...<EM>Elmers Brother: hmmmm the only loser in the video was the left wing comedian who didn't know his history.Ummmmmm, whether it is right is not a question of some version of history but of moral judgment.</EM>but the dumbass lefty comedians morality it based on his flawed view of history.elmers brotherhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03382038085149828957noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5516627478339613810.post-57857525378142414452009-05-05T22:55:00.000-07:002009-05-05T22:55:00.000-07:00Ahhh, Z, it seems you would you prefer that Bush h...Ahhh, Z, it seems you would you prefer that Bush had said: “Damn the critics–––unleash nuclear hell”? “Baghdad, Kabul, Islamabad, Tehran, wipe them off my maps!”<br /><br />Is that not what you’d like, Z?<br /><br /><br /><I>Naturally the common people don't want war; neither in Russia, nor in England, nor in America, nor in Germany. That is understood. But after all, it is the leaders of the country who determine policy, and it is always a simple matter to drag the people along, whether it is a democracy, or a fascist dictatorship, or a parliament, or a communist dictatorship. Voice or no voice, the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is to tell them they are being attacked, and denounce the pacifists for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger. It works the same in any country.</I>— Hermann Goeringpsi bondhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16900724279414147038noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5516627478339613810.post-50599541248768849792009-05-05T20:49:00.000-07:002009-05-05T20:49:00.000-07:00Ya, and maybe less of OUR KIDS would have died. H...Ya, and maybe less of OUR KIDS would have died. HAHA to you, psi.Zhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15989573357446569262noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5516627478339613810.post-60587524182687433792009-05-05T19:28:00.000-07:002009-05-05T19:28:00.000-07:00haa, Z. That’s funny. Bush was held in check by a ...haa, Z. That’s funny. Bush was held in check by a decent respect to the opinions of mankind. Thank God!<br /><br />Not only the geopolitical situation is different now. So are the ethos and the knowledge of the destructiveness of nuclear bombs that the public and politicians share.psi bondhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16900724279414147038noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5516627478339613810.post-48953766967617002702009-05-05T19:15:00.000-07:002009-05-05T19:15:00.000-07:00naa, psi bond..he was scared of you lefties making...naa, psi bond..he was scared of you lefties making a big fuss. He could have bombed and been done with it. He couldn't have been hated more, could he, anyway? <br />And, of course, the geopolitical situation is far different.Zhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15989573357446569262noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5516627478339613810.post-80460759924717139972009-05-05T18:51:00.000-07:002009-05-05T18:51:00.000-07:00Elmers Brother: hmmmm the only loser in the video...Elmers Brother: <I>hmmmm the only loser in the video was the left wing comedian who didn't know his history.</I>Ummmmmm, whether it is right is not a question of some version of history but of moral judgment.psi bondhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16900724279414147038noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5516627478339613810.post-2895889525538304962009-05-05T18:48:00.000-07:002009-05-05T18:48:00.000-07:00FJ: It is PERFECTLY RIGHT to end a war in the MOST...FJ: <I>It is PERFECTLY RIGHT to end a war in the MOST BRUTAL, HORRIBLE, and FRIGHTENING and DESTRUCTIVE means possible. Why? Because it ENDS it and SAVES MILLIONS OF LIVES in the long run. </I>Given your quote, one must suppose that your idol Gen. Sherman, had he access to the most destructive weapons of today, would have nuked Atlanta and other cities of the South without blinking to save soldiers’ lives. (After all, according to him, war is hell, and the civilians on the other side of it are the enemy, period.) That is, assuming his John Wayne style attitude toward war were unaffected by the modern ethos. Of course, nowadays, modern rules of war and respect for civilian communities must be extremely disturbing to arm-chair John Waynes.<br /><br />Bush sacrificed thousands of American lives and hundreds of billions of our dollars to re-engeineer Iraq during almost six years, when he had an ample supply of nukes at the ready on his command. So Bush, by Sherman’s standards, is a war criminal.<br /><br /><I>Can anything be stupider than that a man has the right to kill me because he lives on the other side of a river and his ruler has a quarrel with mine, though I have not quarrelled with him?</I>— Blaise Pascalpsi bondhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16900724279414147038noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5516627478339613810.post-21963313167217359412009-05-05T16:49:00.000-07:002009-05-05T16:49:00.000-07:00Yes, Z, I know & work with wonderful Japanese ...Yes, Z, I know & work with wonderful Japanese believers. Of course, I know that our Lord in this day calls us to love all people enough to get the Gospel of Christ's death & resurrection for them. We as believers work together to do just that, that is the reason I mentioned that we are not Israel, & are certainly not perfect ourselves, far from it. We are in need of the Gospel in this country as much as any lost person in the world. God Bless.David Wyatthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03912850723087704550noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5516627478339613810.post-68703476177107223282009-05-05T16:45:00.000-07:002009-05-05T16:45:00.000-07:00You have to be stunted in some way to not see the ...You have to be stunted in some way to not see the reasoning behind the bombings. Honestly, some people think the world is like a video game or something, where you can do one thing and if it doesn't work, you can just stop restart and trying something else.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5516627478339613810.post-14892489507764124762009-05-05T09:30:00.000-07:002009-05-05T09:30:00.000-07:00hmmmm
the only loser in the video was the left wi...hmmmm<br /><br />the only loser in the video was the left wing comedian who didn't know his historyelmers brotherhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03382038085149828957noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5516627478339613810.post-31951366605941302102009-05-05T09:27:00.000-07:002009-05-05T09:27:00.000-07:00It is PERFECTLY RIGHT to end a war in the MOST BRU...It is PERFECTLY RIGHT to end a war in the MOST BRUTAL, HORRIBLE, and FRIGHTENING and DESTRUCTIVE means possible. Why? Because it ENDS it and SAVES MILLIONS OF LIVES in the long run.<br /><br />You must convince your enemy to STOP. Nothing says STOP like a hundred thousand people being disintegrated at once. We gave them no CHOICE. And that IS WHAT WAR is for, it's the ultimate arbiter of all conflicts. It is NOT something anyone should enter into lightly.<br /><br />As Sherman once said:<br /><br />Every attempt to make war easy and safe will result in humiliation and disaster. I would make this war as severe as possible, and show no symptoms of tiring till the South begs for mercy. If the people raise a great howl against my barbarity and cruelty, I will answer that war is war, and not popularity seeking. My aim then was to whip the rebels, to humble their pride, to follow them to their inmost recesses, and make them fear and dread us. This war differs from other wars, in this particular. We are not fighting armies but a hostile people, and must make old and young, rich and poor, feel the hard hand of war. War is cruelty. There is no use trying to reform it. The crueler it is, the sooner it will be over. War is the remedy that our enemies have chosen, and I say let us give them all they want. War is hell.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5516627478339613810.post-33399790725643624162009-05-05T02:38:00.000-07:002009-05-05T02:38:00.000-07:00Rational people know it cannot be the case that a ...Rational people know it cannot be the case that a touted video (available at a rightwing website) is the last word on this continuing controversy, or that those who are unconvinced of its indubitableness are just awfully dumb.<br /><br />The plain truth is that whether or not it is right for a nation to drop nuclear bombs on populous foreign cities is not a factual question, or a simple one.<br /><br />I recommend John Hersey’s 1946 book <I>Hiroshima</I>.psi bondhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16900724279414147038noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5516627478339613810.post-51814540857979854362009-05-05T00:11:00.000-07:002009-05-05T00:11:00.000-07:00I urge you all to watch the video before respondin...I urge you all to watch the video before responding...<br />thanks.Zhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15989573357446569262noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5516627478339613810.post-65994142871023932442009-05-05T00:01:00.000-07:002009-05-05T00:01:00.000-07:00I get such remarkable vibes at this site. Everyone...I get such remarkable vibes at this site. Everyone, or nearly everyone, here loves his/her Japanese Christian friends, whom they would not falter at reducing to ashes if they felt it would save the life of an American soldier. God must be for that, huh? If you didn’t believe such stuff, surely you’d go nuts, no? That’s right, isn’t it?<br /><br />As we know, feelings are not supposed to be logical.psi bondhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16900724279414147038noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5516627478339613810.post-25452818711971950032009-05-04T19:15:00.000-07:002009-05-04T19:15:00.000-07:00David, if that's opening a can of worms, it's an i...David, if that's opening a can of worms, it's an interesting can of worms and I thank you for it.<br /><br />You know, the argument of many is that Jesus doesn't want us to fight......yet the whole Old Testament is God prompting armies to go and die for a righteous cause. <br />Yes, perhaps all of the things we see these days...even obama's election...are God's bidding...for reasons only He knows, that's for sure. I know wonderful Japanese Christians these days...<br /><br />All I know is that, with what's happening today, if we didn't have God/faith, we'd be some pretty darned hysterical people!Zhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15989573357446569262noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5516627478339613810.post-5811793742389611912009-05-04T18:43:00.000-07:002009-05-04T18:43:00.000-07:00Wow, amazing Z. I hope I'm not opening a can o...Wow, amazing Z. I hope I'm not opening a can of worms, but I must say that I believe there is a connection between this & the issue of how God sometimes called for the destruction of entire nations of people in the OT. Of course, the US is not Israel, & we are certainly not perfect ourselves. Yet we must also remember the fact that God never did this until He had first given these brutal & wicked nations many hundreds of years to repent & they would not. Often these nations practiced such atrocities as we could not imagine. Nineveh is a good example. He sent Jonah & reluctantly he preached & the nation repented & God forgave. Of course, years later they drifted back into their wickedness & the account of God's destruction of them is found in the prophecy of Nahum. The point is, that these wicked nations had to be judged because the gracious God who called for their repentance & gave them years to do it, & who saw their hearts, knew that if they were not judged, their sin & wickedness would spread & cause the destruction of multitudes more. Though judgment is God's "strange act" (Is.28:21) He does it ultimately due to His real & dazzlingly holy love. If we doubt His love, we have only to look to Calvary. God Bless.David Wyatthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03912850723087704550noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5516627478339613810.post-3033926761523276792009-05-04T17:59:00.000-07:002009-05-04T17:59:00.000-07:00Elbro, it seems like so many Americans second gues...Elbro, it seems like so many Americans second guess and make US the bad guy, don't you think?<br />I'll take blame where blame's due, but you're right; we can't KNOW, we weren't there.<br /><br />We had a dinner party years ago with a few older Germans...the conversation got a tad heated because a USC history major was spouting off about NAZIS and the war, etc etc. Suddenly, a VERY soft spoken dear German friend spoke up from the end of the table:<br /><br />"you can't know if you weren't there." I've never forgotten that.Zhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15989573357446569262noreply@blogger.com