Sunday, November 18, 2012

Sunday Blog...........Worth considering?

Jack Hayford: Election Outcome Could Be Prophetic Announcement

32 comments:

Z said...

Meanwhile, Yahoo's headline this morning is ISRAEL FIRES ON GAZA, MAY HAVE CAUSED DEATHS

No headline about Tel Aviv AND JERUSALEM having rockets lobbed at it.

Typical, huh?

Silverfiddle said...

I don't know...

I am not criticizing the man, but rather I am simply saying that we cannot know God's mind.

We do need to rededicate ourselves to putting Christ first in everything, but we have no way of knowing if Our Heavenly Father doles out punishments via election results.

If anything, the campaigns with their relentless steam of bs pouring out of every media orifice is itself a form of hell on earth...

FreeThinke said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Z said...

SF, funny, I read it much less than being punished by God for election results and more about how living without God in our hearts and showing in our actions during our daily lives, and making decisions based on what we know of Him, things don't go too well; like voting for the wrong guy.

conservativesonfire said...

"Unless a reawakening..."

Do you really believe that a reawakenug is possible, Geeeeez? I ask that because I am not aware, which doesn't there are examples in kistory, of any examples where a reawakening has happened after a civilizationor culture has lost the moral fiber that was the common bond which held the culture together. Do you know of any examples in history of a reawakening taking place?

beamish said...

Just another "apolitical" Sunday faith post, right Z?

Ed Bonderenka said...

As I said yesterday.
At some point, according to accepted prophecy (not a guess), Israel will be attacked on all sides. It has happened before. But one of these times it will presage the Tribulation.
That can only happen if America abandons her or is ineffective militarily to support it.
This election put both those conditions in motion.
Hope there really is a Rapture.

Constitutional Insurgent said...

Ed - I think it's possible to be respectful of prophetic beliefs and yet leery of basing national policy on an unprovable religious text.

That said, Israel is quite capable of defending itself in just about every situation imaginable.

If the Church writ large is in need of a reawakening, I hope they find it, yet retain the ideals of liberty towards all citizens, religious or otherwise.

Z said...

Conson Fire...I didn't write this so no, I wouldn't say for sure it's possible. I don't think a culture can hold together without good moral fiber..Hayford is suggesting how to get back to that but when good Christians try, they're mocked for believing in God and feeling their faith is the only faith. Ridiculous, but Alinsky was no dummy.

Beamish, if this hasn't something to do with faith, I honestly don't know what does.

Ed, if anything was pointing to what you say, the fact that Israel still stands at all is pretty good proof!
Let's all hope that 'unprovable text' isn't right because eternity is a terribly long time.
I believe when it is provable, and I believe it will be, that will be the end. Faith isn't necessary when proof is seen.

Brooke said...

It is the 'religious' that will have to force Obama to support Israel, to cease attacking our rights, ect. Unless the Churches begin to assert themselves, this country will be in a world of hurt!

beamish said...

Beamish, if this hasn't something to do with faith, I honestly don't know what does.

I'll meet you half-way and say that if those of strong Christian faith were even one-tenth as involved in politics as they're derided as being, Mitt Romney would have never been the Republican candidate for President.

But Barack Obama wouldn't have been the Democrat candidate either.

-FJ said...

The way a given society chooses to annihilate the excess energy it produces is of the utmost importance. It is around this expenditure that a culture is defined. Whether a society is aggressive, imperialistic, or non-violent all depends on the form the society gives to expenditure of surplus energy. Each society had a defining choice on how it would expend excess resources, building its values on an economically useless expenditure. The artifices of religion and art all form around this essential cultural activity, acting as recipients and modes of expression of the basic embodiment of surplus. Be it a church with its corps of people removed from economic activity, or a frugal dedication of energy in terms of a military structure dedicated to expansion, they all have their origins in the same need to find a channel for excess production.

W/O a vibrant economy, there are NO surpluses that can be expended upon religion. And when the government DIRECTS what surpluses there are to providing a combination of private and public luxuries for the unproductive... well, we all know what becomes of helpless dancers.

FreeThinke said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
JonBerg said...

"this country will be in a world of hurt!"

I'm afraid it already is!

Z said...

beamish, the world would be an altogether better place.

FT, I keep getting the impression that you feel that only the parts of the bible you don't like are legalistic and that whoever reads the bible as the inerrant and only words on this earth FROM God is hateful and ignorant. I hope I'm wrong and I know you'll clarify.
Legalistic is a biblical term and I wonder what you you mean when you use the term frequently. It's a pejorative in what sees to be your definition and mine.
Legalistic in Christian study is generally regarded as , for example, the Jewish interpretation of the Old Testament which would demand we must not eat pork, we must not touch any modern things on the sabbath, one is not a real man without a bar mitzvah..if you don't pray in certain ways and at certain times, you're not a faithful person, etc etc.

Taking refuge in the words is exactly, precisely, what God implores us to do in a billion phrases throughout scripture, isn't it.

Ducky's here said...

@FT Very very terribly true, but I see that as The Church's failure to understand, define, teach and convey the true nature of God's Identity

-------
What of us who feel that the idea of understanding something infinite like God's identity (essence?), is impossible.

For some of us there is only the search. Maybe AN AWFUL ROWING TOWARD GOD as Anne Sexton called it.

Me, I pick up a camera and try to find God in the commonplace. Sometimes I think I get a little closer but I'm going to continue looking. I do look in the Bible but in the Sermon on the Mount. I have no use for Leviticus.

I'm sure this is a position that brings nothing but scorn and derision from the real Christian. The ones who can't see that there is the rub.

Elmers Brother said...

The rub is in the hubris of discarding one part of the Bible

Elmers Brother said...

Especially since Christ gave credibility to the Old Testament by referencing it frequently

Ed Bonderenka said...

http://www.reasons.org/articles/articles/fulfilled-prophecy-evidence-for-the-reliability-of-the-bible

Roughly 2000/2500 prophecies in the Bible have been fulfilled.
Quite a track record.
If I had a stock analyst that good, I'd do everything he told me to do, unquestioning.
Hardly an unproven text.
To the casual observer who doesn't do the research (or read the research) it would be a stretch.
Verses like "for the king's daughter of the south shall come to the king of the north to make an agreement: but she shall not retain the power of the arm;" in Daniel 11 seem vague, yet are so accurate a prediction of world events that until the Dead Sea Scrolls appeared (which preserved a copy of Daniel from before their fulfillment) claims were made that it had to have been written after.

Our Founders built this country on that unprovable text.

Constitutional Insurgent said...

"Our Founders built this country on that unprovable text."

And forged the founding documents as inconveniently secular.

FreeThinke said...

I'm sorry, Z.

Each of us does, indeed, have a radically different approach to Christian faith. We've known that about one another for many years. It's nothing new.

I think, perhaps, I ought to stop commenting here on matters religious, since my thoughts, even though they are intended to inspire curiosity, and give uplift and cheer, always appear unwelcome and attract nothing but stern disapproval with what-feels-to-me-like an underlying tone of resentment.

It has never been my intention to offend or insult anyone, but apparently that's the way my best efforts in this area invariably come off, so I'll try not to participate in these Sunday posts any more.

The very last thing I want is to make trouble for myself -- or anyone else. We've been through more than enough of that already.

God bless us all! I hope our faith, such as it is, will prove strong enough to see us through the increasingly difficult times sure to come since the election, which was merely the latest in a long series of wrong turns and tragic miscalculations.

I didn't mean to be rude. If this were church -- or a prayer meeting -- instead of a blog, and I or anyone else came in and kept interrupting the preacher by vigorously spouting sentiments contrary to the thrust of his sermon, I'd be guilty of gross misconduct -- something akin to CODE PINK -- horror of horrors. ;-)

That may not be exactly what I've done, but I do understand how many regulars here might interpret it that way.

Again, I apologize. I promise you it won't happen again.

~ FreeThinke

98ZJUSMC said...

[i] conservativesonfire said...
"Unless a reawakening..."

Do you really believe that a reawakenug is possible, Geeeeez? I ask that because I am not aware, which doesn't there are examples in kistory, of any examples where a reawakening has happened after a civilizationor culture has lost the moral fiber that was the common bond which held the culture together. Do you know of any examples in history of a reawakening taking place?

November 18, 2012 6:52 AM[/i]

Neither do I and no, I don't. When the State has become God and envy-driven victim identity the Gospel, only a cataclysmic event will kindle a re-awakening among the sea of dopes.

Maybe.

More than 50% have decided that they can vote themselves that which they did not produce. As noted above, Religion is mocked at every turn. I wonder what happens when the Religion of the Federal Government runs out of loaves and fishes? What miracle comes next? Will it, in turn, be mocked?

FreeThinke said...

There! The offending comments are gone.

If anyone is interested in what I think, I hope they'll visit

http://freethinkesblog.blogspot.com/?zx=da63e836789862c5

Take care,

~ FT

Ed Bonderenka said...

FreeThinke:
I don't agree with your belief system as I read your comments, but I'm not offended.
ConsFire didn't offend me either.
Heck, Ducky doesn't offend me.
But I have no compunction against voicing my belief either, particularly on the Sunday Faith blog.

Z said...

98JUSMC...I think God can do anything, but I think He's probably run out of patience!
Thanks for your comments!
I love the line about fish and loaves..good one.


FT...I'm sorry you seem to have read infinitely more into my comment than was said.

Ed....I only draw a line when comments here from seasoned Christians start getting huffy between themselves and I've had that happen; thankfully, it's not happened for a while. I don't do a Sunday Faith Blog to confuse newer Christians, that's for sure. In fact, I've been greatly blessed by private emails telling me this Sunday post has been a respite and even brought them closer to Jesus.

Ducky, it's ALWAYS ABOUT THE SEARCH. ALWAYS.

Jan said...

Well, our salvation is sure, if we have received Christ as Savior, but scripture clearly speaks of the consequences of disobedience, and a turning away from God.

I don't think that anyone here, could do anything but agree that we, as a nation, have done that, obviously.

Our leaders have even declared that we're not a Christian nation, and they voted at the Democratic National Convention that they wanted no part of God.

Remember that?

Their original platform did away with all language to do with God, or Jerusalem being the capitol of the State of Israel. They put it back, of course, but they even had to rig their own votes to do that, because they, as a whole, so vehemently opposed it.

Anyone who has any knowledge of the Bible, knows that God has said that anyone who curses Israel is cursed, themselves, and that we are to pray for the peace of Israel.

You can argue all day long whether or not the Jews are God's chosen People, if you want to, but no one can argue that Jerusalem is God's chosen land, or that it belongs to Him.

I, for one, don't want to be found arguing against God, nor His prophets.

The Bible, also, says that it is a fearful thing to fall into the hands of the living God. (Hebrews 10:31)

I think that Pastor Hayford was speaking in that sense in his very thought provoking essay.

Z said...

Jan, I was JUST thinking we haven't emailed for a while and I miss you and then came over here and here you are!
Well said, Jan,..but, sadly, PLENTY will argue with you about Israel.
I'm with you...I thought Hayford's piece was well worthy of consideration and that we do need to protect Israel.xx

Jan said...

Well, I knew you were busy with your job, Z, and having computer problems,too...but I was thinking 'bout you, and reading here, keeping up with things. :)
xoxo

Liberalmann said...

The church(es) like the GOP better wise up and change quick or they will find many empty pews.

Thersites said...

They start preaching Satanism like the liberals recommend and they WILL be empty.

Elmers Brother said...

Sure, it worked for Sodom and Gomorrah

Right Wing Theocrat said...

Perhaps it started when some succeeded in pushing Christianity out of the public space.

I think it'll be the ruin of your nation and any nation that chooses to strike out on its own without our Christian God guiding it.