Will this subject ever rest? What do you all think of this? True? False? I don't know WHAT to think. What a can of worms.....
Obama went to visit his dying grandmother and bammo!, the birth certificate in Hawaii got 'sealed'. It looks like the visit was one or two days before the governor sealed the records. Do I think he didn't care about his grandmother and he didn't go to Hawaii to visit her on her death bed? Certainly not. Do I think there's still something very odd about the timing? Who wouldn't? His other grandmother has quite an interesting story.....is she to be believed? And what happened to that December 1 date by which Obama had to produce his birth certificate, according to Justice Souter??
OK. Let's put all that aside. Here's my question:
WHAT IF OBAMA'S OUSTED BECAUSE IT'S PROVEN HE WAS NOT BORN IN AMERICA. DO WE GET BIDEN? DO WE HAVE ANOTHER ELECTION? WHAT WOULD HAPPEN?
Just please don't tell me we'd get Biden. I mean, I think we'll get blood in the streets for one thing (God forbid)....but BIDEN?? ARGH.....!!
z
(thanks for the tip, Mustang!)
31 comments:
Cheer up, z. The worlds greatest living mediocrity, Clarence Thomas, has moved to hear a petition from a New Jersey plaintiff on the birth question.
Now this is an activist action but as long as the right approves of the intent activism is not relevant, correct?
But it gets better, if the plaintiff prevails then McCain by virtue of the Panamanian birth is also ineligible.
So when the Electoral College (thank you founding dim bulbs) meets I guess they can vote for Sarah Palin.
Oh, no no..Ducky. McCain's totally legal and YOU KNOW IT.
He was vetted up the kazoo...not THE ONE, of course.. (and they thought Reagan was 'teflon'?)
No, no activism here...Americans like to know our president is legally eligible.
Good try, though.
They'll vote for Sarah if they love this country, still respect our power and sovereignty....we can only hope.
"Whatever" were to happen, it couldn't get worse than "Obama".
z, I wrote that on the basis of the suit which Thomas wants heard that McCain would be ineligible.
It has nothing to do with birth certificate rather it presents a sophist interpretation of "natural born".
The petition itself names McCain and he would be invalidated as a matter of law if this petition were to prevail.
Careful what you wish for.
This is the first I've heard abou the birth certificate thing.
And I'm not surprised. I bet if Sarah Palin was getting birth certificates sealed, we wouldn't be hearing the end of it.
Blog rolled you.
Obviously we get Hillary Clinton.
Christopher Hamilton
The Right Opinion, for the Right Wing
Of topic but important, z. From a statement by the Federal Reserve Board. As we on the left all knew, the CRA is blameless, unless you want to challenge the Fed and why do I suspect you do ...
Conclusions
Our findings are important because neighborhoods and communities affected by the economic downturn will require the active participation of financial institutions. Considering the situation today, many neighborhoods that are not currently the focus of the CRA are also experiencing great difficulties. Our recent review of foreclosure data suggested that many middle-income areas currently have elevated rates of foreclosure filings and could face the prospect of falling into low-to-moderate income status. In fact, 13 percent of the middle-income Zip codes have had foreclosure-rate filings that are above the overall rate for lower-income areas.
Helping to stabilize such areas not only benefits families in these areas but also provides spillover benefits to adjacent lower-income areas that are the traditional target of the CRA. Recognizing this, the Congress recently underscored the need for states and localities to undertake a comprehensive approach to stabilizing neighborhoods hard-hit by foreclosures through the enactment of the new Neighborhood Stabilization Program (NSP). The NSP permits targeting of federal funds to benefit families up to 120 percent of area median income in those areas experiencing rising foreclosures and falling home values.
In conclusion, I believe the CRA is an important model for designing incentives that motivate private-sector involvement to help meet community needs. The CRA has, in fact, been helpful in alleviating the financial isolation of many areas of concentrated poverty, but as our report illustrates, there is much more that could be done in these communities. Contrary to the assertions of critics, the evidence does not support the view that the CRA contributed in any substantial way to the crisis in the subprime mortgage market. Today's discussion is an important first step in the process of identifying other initiatives and areas of cooperation between government and the private sector that will effectively address the continuing challenge of poverty in the United States.
I've believed the Kenyan grandmother from the beginning. I don't think efforts to prove Obama is not a citizen are going to succeed for whatever reason, however. He's "destined" to be our President according to some hints he's made and I think they are going to make sure he is. The Constitution is as good as dead.
Have you also happened to hear that Hillary may not be qualified to be Secretary of State either? Something to do with voting for a pay raise while in office prohibiting the appointment -- I didn't get the whole story clear in my head, but if she did it's expressly prohibited by the Constitution. So we may have another unqualified officer in our government. That's the way the times are going.
Also, I believe Ducky is wrong that McCain is not qualified either because his parents were both American citizens, making him an American citizen no matter where he was born, while in the case of Obama his father was not a citizen.
But these are just negligible little "mistakes" on the part of our Constitution, right, those idiot Founders of ours.
(Frankly, I have a few complaints about our Founders too, but they DID give us a way to change anything in their Constitution we don't like, but everybody ignores that too.)
Let me try going real slow, cj.
The suit that Thomas has asked the court to take up argues that BOTH Obama and McCain should be disqualified because they are not "NATURAL BORN CITIZENS".
It is a piece of sophistry that argues that by virtue of being born on foreign soil they are not "natural born citizens".
So we have to waste time with this nonsense and then we go through other right wing nonsense and waste some time with the "emoluments" clause.
Ducky, what the heck do I care? McCain wasn't MY first or second or third choice. Let them pick another Republican if they do have to have another election.
But his info WAS vetted, not as you'd suggested ; he's not in any jeopardy if he did run.
Obama? Who'd really care except it's against the constitution and he's lied about SO MANY THINGS (and you won't have the guts to ask "WHAT?", I know, because you know very well WHAT) that it stinks all the way down the line. And, thanks to people like you who, like my Independent Doctor said his wife voted for Obama "because she just didn't listen to both sides", didn't care about character and didn't allow yourselvs to hear the truth
Ducky, the two cases are VERY different.
CJ, I've heard Hillary was ineligible because "one can't be a senator and then take a civil position" but that's rightwing hubris; it's just dead wrong..that's happened several times..it's how we GET appointees of this 'stature'
I'm interested in hearing about the pay raise situation...let's let each other know if one of us happens to hear more on that.
ducky, If you read Clarence Thomas' book, you'd never talk about mediocrity again. We should have many more men like him on the SCOTUS.
Funny, obama's already said what litmus tests he'll use for appointments. The media made NOTHING of it, though the congressional hearings on Republicans were ALL ABOUT "Do you have a LITMUS TEST of your OWN preferences? THAT"S UNCONSTITUTIONAL!"
You liberals should all be so, so utterly ashamed.
It's a word I'll be writing about soon; I wish some leftists would read it.
Ducky, it's not a "piece of sophistry" if it's spelled out in the Constitution that you are a citizen if your parents are no matter where you are born, and not if they are not.
You'll have to refer me to a reputable source for your claim ab out Thomas' position that explains exactly why he is taking up the case as you word it, if in fact he is doing so. Otherwise I have the same opinion I expressed and I'm sure Thomas does too.
Here's how it was put at Huffington.
"The issue may seem esoteric but it generated attention Tuesday among legal scholars and bloggers arguing over whether it would be unconstitutional for Mrs. Clinton to serve as President-elect Barack Obama's secretary of state because the salary for her new office was increased while she served in the Senate."
And here's what Judicial Watch has to say about it.
Oh, that's interesting, CJ..thanks.
So since she voted on a pay increase for the job and then may GET it, it could be a problem.
Well, that seems bizarrre to me, doesn't it you, a little? I mean if the law says that, we should obey the law, but she couldn't know she'd have this job...I really appreciate your supplying the information and quoting from whence it came...Some people post and expect us to believe they wrote it...ahem.
Thanks.
Christopher? "Obviously we get Hillary"..
NOBODY has really said what happens, constitutionally....or IS it covered in the constitution...or did I miss a comment that filled us in on WHO WOULD TAKE OVER SHOULD IT BE PROVEN OBAMA'S LIED (Again?) Would it be just like if, GOD FORBID, he died? The VP automatically gets in? I'm curious.
And, no, it brings me no pleasure to consider that a president-elect has lied this much, not at all. And here I am , a little ashamed to call my president a liar, even if I don't admire ..much..anything?..about him.
I also believe she didn't vote for the increase with any view to her own benefit, but how much ignoring of the Constitution can go on without doing irreparable damage to it (which may already have been done some time ago anyway, alas). What do you think of the "Saxbe fix" as a solution to the problem, as outlined at that Judicial Watch link, in which the salary for a person who had voted for an increase is rolled back to its previous level if that person is appointed to the office? I think it's reasonable myself, although JW's position is that the wording of the Constitution doesn't allow for ANY fix. I think as long as any income benefit she MIGHT have voted for with a view to her own future status no longer applies, it ought to be accepted as it is in the spirit of the Constitution's intent.
Perhaps there should be an amendment to that point in the Constitution, saying that anyone who votes for an income increase for a particular office may only qualify for that office at the previous salary level for the entire term of service therein? That would do it for me.
I've assumed the standard Constitutional provision for succession in the case of a President's inability to serve for WHATEVER reason would apply, wouldn't it? So, yes, we'd get Biden.
Biden. About the only person I admire less than obama..except:
Reid
Pelosi
Durbin
Dodd
Frank
Franken
Murtha (he should be on top, actually)
Gore (Second to the top)
waxman
brokaw
walters
O'donnell
moore
mahr
Chopra
Colmes
Schultz
..
....oh, well...you get the picture!
Biden. Disastrous.
Thanks for the good info, CJ. I'm with you on the constitution..we must obey it. And, yes, your idea/solution is a very good one.
If Obama only went because of his care for his grandmother and his belief in her imminent demise then why did he not bring his family with him? Were his girls not about to lose their Great Grandmother as well?
Yes Ducky, I'll take issue with the Feds. The rationale that because other areas or neighborhoods are experiencing great difficulties, does not relieve the CRA of irresponsible or even criminal activity of guaranteeing loans that could not be paid for, and passing on bad paper with aforeknowledge that it was bad.
All this is, is a welfare program which unbelievably now has come to a place where we, the taxpayers are required to subsidize homes for the poor. Why not a car, new furniture?
Now, the government is in the mortgage business to the extent that it's establishing mortgage rates. Thereby controlling banking to the extent that the government says what mortgage rates must be, instead of the free market.
Banking is supposed to be a private enterprise in a free country.
Do you know what it's called when government allows private business but forcibly controls what that business is permitted to do through centralized government control? It's called Fascism.
This is not the first time we have undergone difficult times. The people always have worked our way through difficulties, and came out the better for it as a people. But, we remained free.
Here's another newsflash for you. The politicians don't give a rip about the poor or any of us for that matter. In fact if we behave ourselves and don't disturb their plans, they're satisfied as the long march to full oppression is accomplished.
It's about what it's always been about. Power. But, not power to the people. We are losing power every day in every way, as we speak.
And Ducky, any American who refers to those great men who founded this nation, as dim bulbs, has no conception of what freedom is or what it really means to be free.
Pris
I'm sure that Z knows I'm laid off from work and have been searching for a new job, maybe others do too. One question that is ask on most if not all job applications is, "Can you provide proof of citizenship?" I find it really odd that I should have to prove I'm a citizen to get a blue collar job when our would be president doesn't have to.
"WHAT IF OBAMA'S OUSTED BECAUSE IT'S PROVEN HE WAS NOT BORN IN AMERICA. DO WE GET BIDEN? DO WE HAVE ANOTHER ELECTION? WHAT WOULD HAPPEN?" I don't know. If he is ousted before January 20 I would hope we would have to hold another election. In that case who would hold office until another President was elected? Frightening.
God Bless America, God Save The Republic.
It's my opinion nothing will come of the Obama birth certificate hoopla.
This should have been vetted two years ago. The press wasn't interested or inclined, and they won't be now. The politicians know if they should act on this it would be a political death knell.
If it is true that Obama isn't a natural born citizen, we will have the first illegitimate President in office, and nothing will be done. There is no political courage in Washington to reject this elected President as I see it.
Pris
Pops..Exactly what went thru my mind. But I heard he didn't visit Grandma with the family when they were there on vacation a few months earlier, either. weird.
Don't forget, his aunt was living in a ghetto though she'd been to his swearing in ceremony only 3 years ago or so. Didn't Michelle care enough to keep tabs on an aunt?
Pris..great points. We certainly ARE losing power.
David...I do know that you're unemployed and I hope that changes...excellent point that YOU have to be better vetted than a president. Don't forget, you have to pass security clearances, too, and there are MANY who say the simplest test would would have been flunked by obama's information regarding his friendship with known anarchists and anti-capitalists and Black supremacists like Wright.
TED...thank you for that information.
I really appreciate it and am sorry to see you don't have a blog.
I don't think for one minute that Obama is going to be disqualified as President. I don't care if they find out he's a moslem-born citizen of East Mofoco (or wherever African place his family is from), the libs will find a way to circumvent the Constitution.
Ducky, as representative of the left here, can't be expected to forward an informed opinion anymore than a tube of bathtub caulk will get up and compose a symphony.
John McCain was born to two American citizens, in an area under US jurisdiction (see the 14th Amendment).
Obama, being America's first elected divine personage, has a miraculous birth not easily covered by the US Constitution, as eyewitnesses in Kenya saw his birth and Indonesia claims him as a citizen even as Hawaii can't or won't produce a record of his live birth. We know for a fact that Obama, as Messiah with full miracle god powers, could have been born in Kenya and two hospitals in Hawaii simultaneously.
Beamish......WHY NOT?
Depends on where the star was shining that night.
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