Monday, October 14, 2013

Typical of Hollywood?

Patricia Heaton:  The actress was well-liked for playing a TV mom on "Everybody Loves Raymond," so liberal Hollywood wasn't exactly receptive to her conservative political views when she decided to share them in 2012. After Rush Limbaugh branded law student Sandra Fluke a "slut" for testifying in favor of birth control, Heaton — who opposes abortion, euthanasia, stem cell research*, and the death penalty — criticized the college student in a series of sarcastic tweets, some of which Heaton ended up deleting. In a subsequent interview with Popeater, she said, "We know for a fact there are some people who have said they wouldn't want to work with us because of our politics. We get lumped in with lunatics."

(Z:*  I'd like to see where anybody's opposed to all stem cell research :)  But it sure makes her sound bad, huh?  And, of course, I'm sure she's not against living stem cell research, which has a higher success rate than embryo stem cells.)

James Woods is the latest celeb to find himself in the middle of a media firestorm following a slew of among other things), Woods tweeted that he expects there will be consequences for his opinions."I don't expect to work again. I think Barack Obama is a threat to the integrity and future of the Republic. My country first," Woods replied to one of his followers
anti-Obama tweets earlier this week.  After the 66-year-old actor and vocal conservative called the president a "true abomination."

(Z: by all means...don't hire the guy again.  He thinks differently than liberal Hollywood.   You know, the open minded bunch who deride conservatives for being close minded?)

 So IS Hollywood as open minded as we're to believe?   Isn't it dangerous that we have Americans who love this country and should be entitled to their opinions as much as any other star does but they're insulted and possibly even shut out of working?

What do you think?

Z

90 comments:

Constitutional Insurgent said...

In all honesty, I don't understand the fascination we as a nation have in what overpaid practitioners of make believe think about political issues.

These people are famous for being famous, and no more important than you or I.

Roberta Wright said...

The ugly faces of the screeching Hollywood progressives are at it again. You would think that they know what they are talking about the way that the “Liberal” crowd worships them. For goodness sake, these people are only actors and actresses. don’t make anything more about them. They are not heroes or heroines, so lets not treat them as if they are. As a matter of fact most of these people are just plain stupid.
Didn’t Ed Asner say that “Hollywood Not Criticizing Obama On Syria Because He's Black” Now how stupid is that!. These people are not the “Superheroes” the play on the screen.. ..The Liberal junk put out in the movies today makes me sick, as do lots of the TV shows do. Tina Fey's Sarah Palin imitation never seems to stop. Sean Penn, an avowed leftist in Gangster Squad was a complete bomb.
Even the stupid progressive’s who want to believe in all that stupid propaganda horse manure are finally realizing that they are being manipulated. And besides all that the prices of admission is ridicules.
No wonder there’s a box-office disaster.

Anonymous said...

I take the Laura Ingraham approach:

Shut up and sing! (or dance, or act, or whatever)

I love Hollywood for the art they produce, not their political commentary, most of which is just bandwagon feel-goodism.

I recommend the documentary, Rated R - Republicans in Hollywood

Is Hollywood open minded?

Hells no! There is nothing open minded about today's "liberals" and progressives.

They are doctrinaire, we-say-so control freaks. They almost constitute a mind-control, group-think cult. Free thinkers and dissidents not allowed.

They comically stand on their little hind legs speaking "truth to power," when in fact, they are the power.

Don't believe me? Which gets an actor (or anybody for that matter) in more trouble?

Loudly advocating for abortions and socialism, or being anti-abortion and a practicing Christian who defends her faith and advocates a belief in Jesus Christ?

Today's rebels sure as hell are not on the entrenched, dogmatic left.

-- Silverfiddle

Mustang said...

I almost agree with CI. I think the Hollywood crowd is important to politicians as sources of income, and for their influence. Not that anyone on the left might consider voting for anyone other than the latest, greatest progressive messiah, but rather that the leftist voter will put aside his blowpipe long enough to actually vote. Still, I think America is fortunate that the people who know how to find the MTV channel have no clue about where the local voting precinct is located.

Duckys here said...

Tempest in a teapot.
Fact is that as Costa-Gavras (now there's a leftist) said in a recent interview about his film "Capital", "Hollywood won't finance political films".

This faux outrage over "liberal junk" is pretty silly. Just an indication of how detached the right really is.

Duckys here said...

Good article on Woods

Duckys here said...

Has Patricia Heaton lacked for work?

Linda said...

I think we would all be surprised by the amount of people who are Christians! Hollywood has a few that proclaim their Christianity, and it is a shame the the 'tolerant' left don't support different views from their own ideas.

If everyone of them were honest, they'd give the true numbers that the Christian films bring in.

skudrunner said...

Why would anyone base a political decision on what an entertainer has to say? Most have a limited education and no skills other than to entertain.

I am all for the millionaires in the entertainment industry giving away millions to help the less fortunate, wait a minute they want to give away our money not theirs, I was a bit confused. They remind me of our elected elite, neither has a clue what working for a living means.

Anonymous said...

"Most have a limited education and no skills other than to entertain."


I was surprised at how many are high school dropouts and misfits as well as borderline criminals in their teens too.

Z said...

I think the point's been missed by some of you here.
The point is that they get less work because of their politics.
I'd love to see an article about some liberal whose conservative director let him go upon finding out he was a liberal and how the media'd run with that. Imagine?

Roberta, I finally agree with Asner but am REAL surprised he had the guts to say that. I don't think it's true (I don't think Hollywood even knows what's going on in Syria or where it is!) but it's a gutsy thing to say.

Silverfiddle...that's the thing. Hollywood and the rest of the Left say they're so open minded but, my gosh, let ANYBODY not fit in with their thinking and they are GONE.

Skudrunner; good point; it's our money they want to give away.

Linda..you're probably right. I think there are a lot more Christians than we think everywhere.

Z said...

By the way, was that a hilarious "oops!" on the author's part, saying Heaton is AGAINST STEM CELL RESEARCH?

that really cracked me up.

Z said...

I think it's important to mention that neither Heaton nor Woods has been a vociferous celebrity regarding politics; unlike Sean Penn, George Clooney, Jane Fonda, Susan Sarandon, ..well, we could go on and on and on.

Any of those people get less work or even a little flack from Hollywood for speaking out?

Impertinent said...

@Z:

It takes that many talentless ignorant loons to stand up to a Voight, Grammer, Willis or a Woods.

Duckys here said...

How many of you right wingers bought a ticket for one of the Atlas Shrugged films?
Not many, I assume.

Now, you may have bought one for Dinesh D'Souza's film. It was no blockbuster but it did decent box office. He just doesn't have Michael Moore's editing skills.

Moore is an interesting case. He's had trouble finding distribution even though his films do very good box office and are serious money makers.
See, your enemy is the free market.

Where does the right place something like The Hunger Games on the scale. I wouldn't call it liberal any more than Elysium but I suppose that depends on your ability to recognize the oligarchy.

Fact is that the landscape for progressive film has become much more bleak since most all the indies except Robert Altman (DO watch The Player got chased out by the studios.

Makes you yearn for the old days:
Bunuel
Godard
Eisenstein
Renoir
Pontecorvo
Rosi
virtually every Italian director in the 60's
Kalatozov
Chaplin
Marker
Kluge ...

It's a tremendous list of serious talent that has all but vanished in the contemporary megaplex waste land.

Rita said...

Hollywood doesn't finance liberal films????

Did you see The Butler?

They took an honest man's decades of work in the White House and invented a leftist agenda movie where this good man's work was degraded only because he was black.

He was a "sellout" for being a butler in the White House?

It was a good movie full of lies to promote their agenda.

Duckys here said...

How do you figure that, Rita?

Because if mentions (factually) Ronnie Reagan's sinking sanctions against South Africa?

Z said...

Rita, I have friends who wanted to walk out of The Butler; I felt so sad to hear they got so uptight at, AGAIN, hearing about the klan, etc.
I don't ever quite understand why people need to do nothing but slam America's history. As if ANYBODY liked slavery? As if CONTEXT never matters?

Ya, they said it was very painful to see the really violent scenes against blacks and felt it does nothing to further any agenda of finally putting a difficult past behind us. But, it sure does do a lot to fan flames of division and disenchantment, doesn't it.

Ducky, people have realized what a buffoon Moore is; simple as that.

Z said...

Let me ask this:

DOES ANYBODY HEAR THINK THE LEFT IS SECURE OR OPEN MINDED ENOUGH TO EMBRACE OTHER OPINIONS?


:-)

Oh, by the way, Ducky..check out how well S Africa's done since apartheid's over. Does that mean I was for apartheid? (no, but you'll suggest that because nuance is a tough one for you)..It means that those areas of South Africa where people could walk the streets at night are NO LONGER...and it's a total violent mess now because nothing was done in preparation for freedom.
I happen to know big family farmers in S Africa whose black families who worked their land and in their homes didn't want to leave after apartheid. THEY understood what would happen.
And it did. But you'll NEVER HEAR the dangers in S Africa in our news.
I have actor friends who'd done plays there years ago, no problems with safety EVER....But, they tell me now it's terrible..they have to hide and take private transportation.

Big change, even beneficial change, takes TIME to plan. Time to teach those who are involved. Everybody loses now. Time to examine how it's going to work.

Same as Obama care, come to think of it.

Duckys here said...

@z --- Ducky, people have realized what a buffoon Moore is; simple as that.

-----
That's why his films make money.

Z said...

Right, Ducky, maybe that's why "his films have difficulty finding distribution."

Duckys here said...

Yeah, go figure, z.

D'Souza's documentary is touted as a huge success when it does less box office.

Fact is that Moore's films are successful and he knows how to get them in theaters despite resistance.

Face it, this "liberal Hollywood" thing is largely a myth touted by people with a reactionary agenda that isn't very popular.

FreeThinke said...

It all depends on your definition of "success."

Which was the more successful speech in Shakespeare's Julius Caesar -- that of Brutus, or of Mark Antony? Then, ask yourself which was the BETTER speech?

If you dig into it, and really make the effort to answer it for yourself, you'll have no trouble seeing what I'm driving at.

Thersites said...

Where does the right place something like The Hunger Games on the scale. I wouldn't call it liberal any more than Elysium but I suppose that depends on your ability to recognize the oligarchy.

Elysium... the Left's argument for obamacare and the immigration bill wrapped in a $200 million special effects budget.

Z said...

Ducky, who's even talking about Dinesh's film?

I'm talking about celebs and how they oftentimes don't get hired for their beliefs that differ from liberal Hollywood.
And, by the way, his film is touted as a huge success? :-) I don't know a soul who saw it, but maybe...??

Does Moore sneak his films into the projection room? Rough to have success with difficulties getting distribution.


Look...there's BIAS, get over it.
You guys rule..TV and the big screen. And you're winning; what're you so darned upset about?
You should be thrilled!

You've taken so much from America and you'll be the first person shocked that it's so different.
You should have moved to E Germany when it was behind the wall. You'd have loved it and we could have continued enjoying our country; warts and all.

Joe Conservative said...

I had a good laugh over at the Puffington Toast this morning reading all the progressive liberal complaints about Republicans in Congress listening to the "Tea Party Echo Chamber"...

...now just think about that for a moment.

We FINALLY break AWAY from the MSM 3 network PROGRESSIVE echo chamber, and now the oligarchy worshiping Hollywood liberals have the GALL to complain that it's no longer a NATIONAL echo chamber.

DittoMan said...

James Woods said on Twitter “I don’t expect to work again,”after calling out President Obama for his rank hypocrisy in closing down the World War II Memorial but allowing a protest of illegal aliens to occur at the “closed” National Mall.
I think Barack Obama is a threat to the integrity and future of the Republic. My country first.”
Yeah, Leah Remini is also fairly conservative as well as a Scientologist,and has gone from one long-running sitcom to another; Kelsy Grammer is also Repub, is he not? And he's had a long career in spite of a lot of bad publicity
Adam Sandler, and Gary Sinise and Bruce Willis are all outspoken conservatives with very long careers.
Having said that, I think it's probably true that there is a strong aspect of social networking and favoritism in professional Hollywood circles. People hire their friends, and recommend their friends, and introduce their friends. And most actors are liberal, and liberals and conservatives have challenges to overcome in forming friendships. It's not impossible to do it, but I can see how conservatives in Hollywood these days may sometimes have a tougher time socially than outspoken liberals.
Add these to the parade of shitty actors who blame their lack of work on their political views instead of their lack of talent.

Joe Conservative said...

btw - D'Souza's 1st film did 5x the Box Office that Michael Moore's 1st film, "Roger & Me", did.

Z said...

Joe, plus..who belongs to the Tea party? DO YOU? I don't.
I'm sure many do, but they had disappeared until now and, suddenly, the Lefties are blaming the Tea Party because the left's own WH planning SUCKS?

I laugh at this, too.

Sure, blame it on some TEA PARTY that's not been in the news for MONTHS, all of a sudden.

And yes..it's FINE if there's a LIBERAL ECHO CHAMBER< but let the Right start speaking up and HELL TO PAY!

Man, can't they just understand the Affordable Care Act STINKS? And it's Congress' RIGHT to try to stop what people don't want? or what doesn't work?

I have yet to find one doctor who's in favor of it (must be because they're such stinkin' capitalists and only care about money, not patients, right..? Just thought I'd beat my lefties to the punch!)

Joe Conservative said...

Face it, this "liberal Hollywood" thing is largely a myth touted by people with a reactionary agenda that isn't very popular/

lol!

Liberals have NO problem getting Hollywood to PRODUCE their films... their problem is that once produced, no one in America want's to pay money to go see them. That's why the Left invented PBS. Only government subsidies could ever save the Hollywood establishment from itself.

Z said...

DittoMan, I didn't know Sandler was an 'outspoken conservative'...
Kelsey Grammar isn't 'outspoken', either, though he belongs to a group I belong to of Hollywood types who are conservatives...The ONLY way I knew he was on the Right was through that...Also, Jon Voight started this group.....with Gary Senise. The group helps network with the young actors, musicians, etc., who HAVE been told they won't work unless they echo liberalism. The group's growing.
Gary SEnise, too, works for wounded soldiers but I have never heard his politics except in that group as he speaks. He's not outspoken at all about it.
Leah Remini?

As much as I follow politics and media, I had never heard she's remotely conservative..who knew?

Well...I'm just laughing here at the very thought that Hollywood types DON'T have to keep their faith OR their politics quiet...

Keep believing I'm wrong...I'd much rather that I was, believe me.

Duckys here said...

I don't know where this bias is, z.

You post a article about two actors.

One has all the work she can handle and two hit sit-comes. The bias is not evident.

The other is a constant whiner who hasn't done much but voice work in the last 15 years primarily because he isn't very good.

But really, where is this bias?

If The Butler is your example of bias then you haven't much to complain about.

For every Susan Sarandon there is a Clint Eastwood. This bias is nothing but a talk radio meme that can't stand a reality test.

Fact: Hollywood makes very few political films.

Any left wing Hollywood was decimated by McCarthy and , dare I say it speaking of political actors, Ronald Reagan.
Have there been any left wing politicians in California at the level of Reagan and Schwarzenegger?
No.

To listen to the right you'd swear that Godard and Costa-Gavras were presidents of Sony and Viacom.

Z said...

Joe...come ON. People aren't going to the movies because of the economy and, even then, they're doing pretty well in the box offices.
You really think films aren't being seen because they're done by libs??

Z said...

http://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/officials-libyan-al-qaida-suspect-arrives-in-us-for-trial-after-questioning-aboard-us-warship/2013/10/14/6e816b70-34fc-11e3-89db-8002ba99b894_story.html?wpisrc=al_national


COMPLETELY off topic:
Hadn't this country, particularly those in Manhattan, won the game the WH was playing risking NYC by holding trials in the city?
How'd this happen?

Joe Conservative said...

The Left NEEDS a bogeyman, Z. Today it's the Tea Party, tomorrow it's those go-along-to-get-along establishment Republicans like Susan Collin's and Bob Corker who surrendered to Obama so as to cut big $$$ deals for their corporate masters/donors.

Pope of Grenich Village said...

Talk about double standards! Lets take Corey Booker (Ultra Liberal) for example who is running against Steve Lonegan (Conservitive)for Senator of New Jersey
Corey Booker’s city of Newark is in shambles! It’s unemployment rate is double the national average at 14%. Its crime rate is skyrocketing with a record breaking 10 murders in 10 consecutive days period just a few weeks ago. Yet the same corrupt media and Hollywood celebrity class that put another media myth in the White House portrays Booker as a raging success. But they fail to mention that Booker as the worst record ever, with a murder rate that’s sky high. And an Obama ass kisser..
And he’s running against Lonegan is former Bogota Mayor and once was state director of the anti-tax group for Americans for Prosperity. So Booker who has has a lead in the polls as high as 37 percent now leads by 10 percent, the election is this Wednesday.

This is the kind of ignorance that plagues certain voters, and makes debt discussions so difficult.

Joe Conservative said...

You really think films aren't being seen because they're done by libs??

Did you see Elysium?

Jodi Foster played the "evil" Republican. Even the Left panned her performance.

Foster, a fine actress who hunted cuddly serial killer Anthony Hopkins in The Silence of the Lambs and, at thirteen, was tough enough to keep DeNiro’s Travis Bickle at bay in Taxi Driver, turns in a performance so broad that one begins to believe that she thinks she’s in a parody.

People aren't going to their films because their over-politicized themes are beginning to be mistaken for parody.

Joe Conservative said...

Left to their own devices, every film out of Hollywood would be about the surge in Midwestern Boy Dance Party's....

...but only a few gays in Detroit and San Francisco will ever spend money at the box office to go see it.

Z said...

"needs a bogeyman?" No kidding, Joe :-) Yes, that was my point...SUDDENLY, it's THE TEA PARTY and the way the news presents Cruz is THE TEA PARTY GUY.
Just because they go for him.
The media/left can't admit anybody's going over big because HE COULD BE RIGHT!

and no, I have NO IDEA what Elysium's about..or what Foster did (i'll check it out, thanks)...I know that Republicans are slammed and played as evil so much that much of America IS starting to look at it as ridiculous...you can see awakening a little also on the late night shows which used to be far further left.

FreeThinke said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Rita said...

Do you have trouble with reading comprehension, Dukky?

The entire film was a big lie. The man that served the White House honorably was not upset because he had failed to overcome a black butler bias. It was all politically correct bull.

Personally I thought the film was amazing, and I was very upset by being reminded how incredibly horrible those times were. But what was more upsetting was knowing how many black actors in that film failed to realize today's America is nothing like that now.

It's important to remember, but comparing a POS thug like Trayvon Martin to Emmitt Till (who was mentioned in the film) just after filming The Butler tells you how much BS liberal Hollywood is.

It's disgusting that instead of actually telling the story of an honorable man, they turned it into a degrading of providing butler services in the White House. That good man was no "sell out" to his race and that was the entire message of the movie.

But you go ahead and spout your ignorance, we're all used to it here.

Z said...

Rita, thanks for your excellent comment. You make such a good point about the 'good man'...there were MANY. Probably a lot of black 'good men' who served in that kind of capacity did it out of love of country and with DIGNITY. To do good for their president.
That program on the black woman who served in the White House for many years (I've forgotten her name) was fabulous. She was FAMILY in the WH. Same goes for whites who served and still do, but the black servers are 'downtrodden' and we're 'racist' for having them do those jobs. (so silly).

I didn't see THE BUTLER (but would like to)...but my naturalized American mother said she knows very well about the way Blacks were treated but it hurt her to much to see it on the screen in such graphic detail, apparently. She called and said "Why do we have to keep being reminded? It was so ugly and it gives nobody any feeling but bad." "Ya, Mom, I know...it's important that we Americans feel REAL BAD about our pasts.......don't ask me why."

FT...couldn't agree with you more.And who's fighting for us and our next generation?
nobody.

Anonymous said...

POS thug like Trayvon Martin! Amen!

Rita said...

Oddly enough I do recommend the film. But then there are other films that have a liberal bias, but are well written and acted.

Even TV shows. I loved West Wing and Boston Legal, but I got sick of conservatives and Republicans being made to look like idiots.

Grammer's show Boss was also amazing. That was ine show that didn't take a stance on a particular side, but a fictional (supposedly) corruption of the Chicago political system, so one might interpret it to have been depicting liberals in a bad light. ;). Sadly it only lasted two seasons. Grammer was absolutely frightening int h series.

Z said...

Rita, since Mom is SUCH a HUGE fan of America, being naturalized, etc., and having had a wonderful life here...I thought maybe she was overly sensitive about the scenes of violence in The Butler...did you think they were gratuitous?

What purpose do you see in them? Do you think there's a living soul who doesn't know about the violence to Blacks back in that day? Could they have left the scenes out?


Rita said...

I have no doubt that many people would give their right arm to be a servant in the White House, black or white.

Nancy Reagan was the only one who invited the man to a State Dinner. And instead of displaying how amazing that jesture was for a butler of any color, the movie actually said that was when the Butler knew he had sold out.

That was when I started realizing the entire movie was nothing but propaganda. I hadn't realized the entire story was fictional and I doubt most who saw it ever researched the real man when they got home to find it was all a lie.

Z said...

Rita...they film says the butler thought he'd sold out because he had the honor of being invited as a GUEST? WHAT??

Please tell us a tad about the true story...because I haven't researched it and hoped that the truth was not what the film said.

Rita said...

Z. The movie interspersed real footage with the movie. I guess at the time I didn't feel like it was just sensationalizing, I thought it needed to be in the movie to explain how bad the times were. They sensationalized it by inventing some stupid story line about his son.

I was a young girl during that time, but I still remember how awful the King and Kennedy assignations were. Of course I know of the horrible things that blacks were subject to,but seeing it in the middle of the movie did bring it to life.

But I spent all those moments knowing that Winfrey had just compared Trayvon to Till and I just shook my head that as a black woman who was just reminded of how disgusting those times were she had the nerve to make that comment.

That sickened me.

It made a mockery of Till's murder. For that she should be ashamed.

Z said...

I can't find anything ON Eugene Allen that says one way or the other how he felt. That's the butler's name, correct, Rita?

Z said...

Well, good...so it was real footage and not gratuitous.
Mom felt assaulted by it, but maybe because she hadn't seen REAL FOOTAGE before, only heard of how bad it was.

Thersites said...

Liberals NEED to find racism in the "other" (Republican) party. Here's why:

Slavoj Zizek, "Multiculturalism, the Reality of an Illusion"

The prohibition of racist speech should not then be taken literally: rather it is a way of imagining ‘us’ as beyond racism, as being good multicultural subjects who are not that. By saying racism is over there –‘look, there it is! in the located body of the racist’ – other forms of racism remain unnamed, what we could call civil racism. We might even say that the desire for racism is an articulation of a wider unnamed racism that accumulates force by not being named, or by operating under the sign of civility.

The best example one can imagine of this are the presidential elections in France a couple of years ago when Jean-Marie le Pen made it into the second round: reacting to this racist-chauvinist threat, the entire “democratic France” joined their ranks behind Jacques Chirac who was reelected with an overwhelming majority of 80%. No wonder everyone felt good after this display of French anti-racism, no wonder people “loved to hate” le Pen: by way of clearly locating racism in him and his party, the general “civil racism” is rendered invisible. In a homologous way, there was, in Slovenia, around a year ago, a big problem with a Roma (Gipsy) family which camped close to a small town. When a man was killed in the camp, the people in the town started to protest against the Roma, demanding that they be moved from the camp (which they occupied illegally) to another location, organizing vigilante groups, etc. As expected, all liberals condemned them as racists, locating racism into this isolated small village, while none of the liberals, living comfortably in the big cities, had any everyday contact with the Roma (except for meeting their representatives in front of the TV cameras when they supported them). When the TV interviewed the “racists” from the town, they were clearly seen to be a group of people frightened by the constant fighting and shooting in the Roma camp, by the constant theft of animals from their farms, and by other forms of small harassments from the Roma. It is all too easy to say (as the liberals did) that the Roma way of life is (also) a consequence of the centuries of their exclusion and mistreatment, that the people in the nearby town should also open themselves more to the Roma, etc. – nobody clearly answered the local “racists” what they should concretely do to solve the very real problems the Roma camp evidently was for them.

One of the most irritating liberal-tolerant strategies is to oppose Islam as a great religion of spiritual peace and compassion to its fundamentalist-terrorist abuse – whenever Bush or Netanyahu or Sharon announced a new phase in the War on Terror, they never forgot to include this mantra. (One is almost tempted to counter it by claiming that Islam is, as all religions, in itself a rather stupid inconsistent edifice, and that what makes it truly great are its possible political uses.) This is liberal-tolerant racism at its purest: this kind of “respect” for the other is the very form of appearance of its opposite, of patronizing disrespect. The very term “tolerance” is here indicative: one “tolerates” something one doesn’t approve of, but cannot abolish, either because one is not strong enough to do it or because one is benevolent enough to allow the Other to stick to its illusion – in this way, a secular liberal “tolerates” religion, a permissive parent “tolerates” his children’s excesses, etc.

Thersites said...

(cont) Where I disagree with Ahmed is in her supposition that the underlying injunction of liberal tolerance is monocultural – “Be like us, become British!” I claim that, on the opposite, its injunction is cultural apartheid: others should not come too close to us, we should protect our “way of life.” The demand “Become like us!” is a superego demand, a demand which counts on the other’s inability to really become like us, so that we can then gleefully “deplore” their failure. (Recall how, in the apartheid South Africa, the official regime’s ideology was multiculturalist: apartheid is needed so that all the diverse black tribes will not get drowned into our civilization…) The truly unbearable fact for a multiculturalist liberal is an Other who effectively becomes like us, while retaining its specific features.

Furthermore, Ahmed passes between two forms of racism which should be distinguished. First, there is the “reflexive racism”: we use our non-racism to distinguish ourselves from the racist other and thus to castigate them in a racist way. More precisely, one should distinguish, in a kind of spectral analysis, three different modes of today’s racism. First, there is the old fashioned unabashed rejection of the (despotic, barbarian, orthodox, Muslim, corrupt, oriental…) Other on behalf of the authentic (Western, civilized, democratic, Christian…) values. Then there is the “reflexive” Politically Correct racism: the multiculturalist perception of Muslims or Balkans as the terrain of ethnic horrors and intolerance, of primitive irrational war passions, to be opposed to the post-Nation-State liberal-democratic process of solving conflicts through rational negotiations, compromises and mutual respect. Racism is here as it were elevated to the second power: it is attributed to the Other, while we occupy the convenient position of a neutral benevolent observer, righteously dismayed at the horrors going on down there. Finally, there is the reversed racism: it celebrates the exotic authenticity of the Balkan Other, as in the notion of Serbs who, in contrast to the inhibited, anemic Western Europeans, still exhibit a prodigious lust for life – this last form of racism plays a crucial role in the success of Emir Kusturica’s films in the West. – Second, racists themselves become a “threatened minority” whose free speech must be protected, i.e., they use the prohibition as evidence that racism is a minority position which has to be defended against the multicultural hegemony. Racism can then be articulated as a minority position, a refusal of orthodoxy. In this perverse logic, racism can then be embraced as a form of free speech. We have articulated a new discourse of freedom: as the freedom to be offensive, in which racism becomes an offence that restores our freedom: the story goes, we have worried too much about offending the other, we must get beyond this restriction, which sustains the fantasy that ‘that’ was the worry in the first place. Note here that the other, especially the Muslim subject who is represented as easily offended, becomes the one who causes injury, insofar as it is the Muslim other’s ‘offendability’ that is read as restricting our free speech. The offendable subject ‘gets in the way’ of our freedom. So rather than saying racism is prohibited by the liberal multicultural consensus, under the banner of respect for difference, I would argue that racism is what is protected under the banner of free speech through the appearance of being prohibited.

Rita said...

I would say watching it IS upsetting, but I'm one that thinks it's sometimes good to be upset about how things were in the past. But one would think seeing that would highlight how far things have come, but sadly some used it to act like it's worse today.

And of course they didn't explain WHO was against civil rights and who fought for them. And as Dukky liked to point out, it displayed Reagan as being a bigot because he decided to take a different course of action on Apartheid. They wouldn't explain WHY Reagan took that action.

Anonymous said...

Liberals -Progressives, SUCK be it Actors, politicians, or Bloggers.

Z said...

Thersites, the writing of that piece is so in circles I'm a little confused but believe I agree with most of it.
By the way, we in America have NO IDEA how bad that gypsy "Roma" problem is throughout Europe, particularly around Rome, Italy, but in Romania, Hungary, etc etc...AWFUL!
And yes..GOD FORBID anybody actually says "it's THEY who steal all the flatware in the restaurant.." or "THEY who attacked that family"...

Z said...

Rita, some DO think it's worse today; THIS is how SICK the left has made us.
Mom's 82...she didn't like those shots AT ALL.

Rita said...

Was she here at the time, Z? Maybe it's because she didn't realize how horrible the KKK was back then. I was raised Catholic, and I remember my mom talking about how in their small southern Indiana town! many Catholics (it was a Catholic town) would find crosses burning in their yards back in the 40's and 50's.

The left has been SOOOOO successful to rewrite history to convince many that the Republicans were against civil rights and the Dems were the ones in the right side of history.

How did THAT lie ever take hold?

Kid said...

Why is there only one hollywood ?
Let's change that. I'll kick in 10 bucks ;-)

hollywood has always been democrat communist.

Well, until people reject it in force, it will continue. Money is the ultimate driver there.

As in why is alec baldwin still working. One Serious woman abuser and a*.
Z, asner is extremely far left. No doubt int he top .0001% of super crazy.
How about james brolin, who I heard talking about 'Celebrating 9-11' on the radio a few years ago. I wanted to put my fist followed by my body through the speaker.

To your point, the ones who are really rabid left get a lot of work. The dude in Gravity for example.

Then you have your absolute morons, who somehow are idolized, spewing out wisdom. Cher, dropped out in 8th grade, etc.

hollywood used to be full of WWII veterans. Jimmy Stewart B24 bomber pilot for example. Exceptional story in his case.

Audey Murphy, 2nd most decorated soldier ever

Many more.

Further from topic. Last night, the military channel had a re-enactment movie about a Lancaster Bomber crew, where most of the crew of 7 went the 30 bomber missions over Germany to be rotated out of bomber duty. It's a great story if you see it come up again.
The English were tough! The American B-17 crews only had to go 25.

Duckys here said...

@kid --- Audey Murphy, 2nd most decorated soldier ever
-----
He couldn't act.

Rita said...

Don't you ever tire of being a bore. Duk?

Kid said...

Rita, he doesn't get tired, or embarrassed, and he doesn't even know he's a bore. he only thinks in terms of 'how can I vanquish the incredible Kid....how...' 'how can I diminish the conservatives and try to convince everyone that they don't really want to be citizens full of liberty and opportunity, but be subjects of imbeciles, tyrants, and dictators... how can I achieve this goal of mine.....

you can't duck. Not unless the American gene pool has been so diluted with the diseased genes of losers that it will collapse. Problem, is the silent majority is still the majority. and imbeciles, tyrants, and morons who have forgotten who they work for will be given a rude awakening one day.

Tyrants? Yea tyrants...
How many times has the imbecile obama declared 'I'm not a tyrant or a dictator' and how many times had Bush, Clinton, or any other president for that matter.

Wise people know those who protest too much are guilty.

Divine Theatre said...

This was a rhetorical question. However, those who supply the bread and circuses are placed there intentionally . A role within a role, so to speak. Liberal film makers deliberately choose people who don't fight the bigger picture.
The movies they create are, for the most part, filled with liberal bias and hooey. It made them into millionaires and they are too lacking in character to choose what's right over what benefits them. Typical liberals.
As a mother, I find it difficult to allow my daughter to watch much of anything that was created recently. Hence, her love of Mr. Ed, Ma and Pa Kettle and Father Knows Best!



Andie

Rita said...

Wouldn't you think anyone with even a minute amount of intelligence would tire of repeating the ignorant mantra over an over?

I used to seem like Duk could occasionally at least be entertaining, now he's just a headache and I wonder why doesn't he try to find friends amongst his ilk.

I will give him this much credit at least he isn't as extremely nasty as those that came here for a short time from FT's. They are the most intolerant example of what the left has to offer which was why I rarely commented there or here when they infiltrated this site with their bull.

Kid said...

Rita, good point and question. By my experience on the net which spans about 20 years, there are two types of liberals out there.

Those who are rabid nasty. Enough said.

Those that repeat and chant the liberal mantra day in and day out, 99% of it consisting of the tired talking points that have been proven absurd over and over and over again.
Doesn't matter though, it is the fantasy reality they have chosen for themselves and there is nothing you can do for them. Even if you get them to scream out that you've been able to convince them they're wrong, they'll be back tomorrow with the same tired absurd talking points.
That's the sad part of it. You can't help them. So, when I just go total silly on them and have some fun, this is the reason. They can't be taken seriously. If I thought even one of them could be helped, I'd put some effort into it. But Noooooooooooooo. ;-)

Rita said...

And with a OT warning. We went to see Captain Phillips last night.

Absolutely amazing, edge of your seat movie.

Tom Hanks will get the Oscar for this one. But so should the former limo driver turned actor from Somalia.

Riveting. Must see in the theater. But beware, two of my fiends actually became sea sick.

Duckys here said...

Well kid, you really seem to know your cinema history but in the matter of a leftist voice in American film, it's been purged twice.

Actually three times if you count the Hays code.

As I said, the first was the McCarthy era with your hero Reagan naming names and ruining careers for no good reason.

Then the rather short lived "New Hollywood" was purged with the return of the blockbuster in Jaws and Star Wars. That and the executives found out that in spite of Peckinpah's intent in "The Wild Bunch", audiences paid to see very graphic choreographed violence.

So now you have "franchises". And the whole movie going experience is disappearing.

But I'd be interested in knowing your version of the history and just what "liberal" memes you find in contemporary film.



Rita said...

*****Y A W N**********

Kid said...

I'm sure you would duck. heheh.

As far as the point you're trying to make, I have no idea where to start. You'll need to be a bit more specific. Break it down into bite sized chunks.

Let's see though, a shark eats an inebriated nude woman, then starts in on the local towns people, morphs into a Jedi, blows up a Death Star, then directs a film where people are flung backwards into saloon walls using cables attached to girdle devices after being shot with various nasty dirty guns to make it all look kinda real and awesome kinda.

Am I close.

Anyway, I agree the general movie going experience has been reduced to young kids with few ideas for a date taking same to a movie that has about as much quality as the average SNL 'musical segment' that regardless how much it stinks to high Heaven, the audience goes wild and applaud like trained seals on too much fish and Qualude 714's just recently digested.

But in line with pretty much the rest of popular culture, adverts, product offerings, political grandstands, you name it. Pretty much pathetic. What say you?

Ed Bonderenka said...

Duck, the point isn't that the films are overtly political like Costa Gravas, et al, but that the message is one long commercial for the leftist viewpoint.
And Audie could act.
He acted like Audie and it was good enough.

Kid said...

Ed, Put simply, which means Duck's not gonna get it...

How many people have a bright, sunny, opportunity filled, happy, healthy, view of the Future?

Not many, If any.

Demoralization is job one when taking over a civilization.

And unfortunately, there are few who Can't be demoralized (I think, or not enough). So, it becomes self-fulfilling, and the imbecile dictators take over.

- Frank Zappa - 1970

I am gross and perverted
I'm obsessed 'n deranged
I have existed for years
But very little had changed
I am the tool of the Government
And industry too
For I am destined to rule
And regulate you

I may be vile and pernicious
But you can't look away
I make you think I'm delicious
With the stuff that I say
I am the best you can get
Have you guessed me yet?
I am the slime oozin' out
From your TV set

You will obey me while I lead you
And eat the garbage that I feed you
Until the day that we don't need you
Don't got for help...no one will heed you
Your mind is totally controlled
It has been stuffed into my mold
And you will do as you are told
Until the rights to you are sold

That's right, folks..
Don't touch that dial

Well, I am the slime from your video
Oozin' along on your livin'room floor

I am the slime from your video
Can't stop the slime, people, lookit me go

Ed Bonderenka said...

Well put Kid.

Duckys here said...

"The leftist viewpoint"?

We probably disagree on just what that is but let it go.

George Clooney, big leftist. Just how does "Gravity" subliminally advance the leftist viewpoint?
Tom Hanks and "Captain Phillips"? Hanks promoting a leftist agenda?

Fact is, it isn't there. As we can read in this thread, leftist means not acknowledging Ronald Reagan's sainthood. That's about it but if you see a leftist meme in the marvel comics franchise let me know.

Heck, Iran has produced more progressive films in the last few years than Hollywood.

Rita said...

Didn't realize Zappa was a prophet.

Kid said...

Ed, Thanks.

Rita, Yes, he could get to the core of a subject fairly often.

Duck, no idea what you're talking about.

Z said...

Ducky, no, leftist doesn't mean that at all and your insult doesn't fly;

leftist means a group who don't care that our kids aren't getting an even handed education.

Leftist means our four year olds are learning about sex

leftist means all little kids go to the same bathroom now in school

leftist means your neighbor with more money must help you out

leftist means taking my great doctors away and saying I can keep them

leftist means slamming the founding fathers

leftist means saying christians are scarier than muslim terrorists

leftist means insisting you're right

leftist means not allowing for other viewpoints

leftist means electing people with no experience to the presidency. Twice.

Leftist means slamming happily married people with healthy children

leftist means taking healthy competition from our kids

leftist means little boys need pink bedrooms so they don't act like boys..

leftist means believing that global warming is happening even if the facts prove differently

....man, could I go on and on. And I'll let my friends here fill in any blanks...I'm pooped.

And, by the way, Ducky, my job here isn't to convince you of anything; if you believe there's no leftist bias in this country; GOOD FOR YOU

Z said...

Kid, your comments ROCK!!

And Rita's right...Zappa WAS a prophet...maybe that WASN'T "crappa" after all :-)

Duckys here said...

You mean you can't point to this leftist "meme" you claim is endemic to Hollywood.
Of course you can't.

Exactly how does what Zappa is talking about tie in to liberal Hollywood?
It ties into capital but you've always been keen on letting it rule you.

You seem confused, kid.

Jack Whyte said...

Those who can, do. Those who can’t, teach. This probably explains how Ducky can wax eloquent about things he knows nothing about, or why he never made it in filmography and cinema. He is nothing if not a storehouse of useless BS.

Kid said...

Z ! Good Stuff There !

Bravo. Let's collaborate on a book called Being a Leftist. I could add some things and I know you could.

Kid said...

Thanks Z. Zappa was given a label that most people applied but he was a revolutionary and just took a strange route. If one gets past what they don't like about the guy, such as "Dynamo Hum" as an example, there is a lot there. He always rejected the norm which is why I listened. His last album Joe's Garage, he narrated the into to some of the tunes as "This is the Central Scrutinizer" (The government)

Little language in the front here

Kid said...

Last album as he was dying of prostate cancer...

Duckys here said...

Jack, I made an excellent living as a film editor.

Pitch till you win.

Z said...

Ducky, NOW I get it...you literally don't understand. Whew.


Kid, I'd never heard WATERMELON before...
Very cool guitaring, but I think the images are weird, don't you? Nice, but collaborative? I don't know!

Kid said...

Before I leave it. One of my favorite images of FZ, since above all else he was a guitar player

Kid said...

Jack, Exactly !
Z, Exactly. he doesn't get it.

Joe's Garage is a musical autobiography of sorts. That's one of the final tunes.

Kid said...

Z, yes, the pictures are just someone's imagination as they put the youtube together. Nothing to do with Frank.

Duckys here said...

I get it alright, z.

When put to you, you can't identify this supposed liberal meme in Hollywood.

Z said...

Ducky, the liberal meme is so obvious it needs no discussion.

By the way, You tell US what's LIBERAL if you disagree with all we say.

I'd like to hear your definition.

Rita said...

You really CAN'T read, can you DUK?

I started my comment regarding the movie Captain Phillips with OT. That stands for Off Topic since you seem to be unfamiliar with OT.

I only brought it up because Z and I were discussing another movie.

I did not draw any reference to it being a leftist agenda.

Why don't YOU try pitching till you win. Smh. (That stands for shaking my head since you seem to have issues with interpretations)

Thersites said...

Film with actual box office revenue = film that left the leftism at home.

even leftists have got to eat.