Wednesday, April 28, 2010

Mexican Immigration Law

It's odd that Mexico is complaining about the U.S. immigration policy. Here are some of the immigration laws I've just been alerted to which are part of the Mexican constitution.....can this really BE?

1. Mexico welcomes only foreigners who will be useful to Mexican society:
2. Foreigners are admitted into Mexico "according to their possibilities of contributing to national progress." (Article 32)
3. Immigration officials must "ensure" that "immigrants will be useful elements for the country and that they have the necessary funds for their sustenance" and for their dependents. (Article 34)
4. Foreigners may be barred from the country if their presence upsets "the equilibrium of the national demographics," when foreigners are deemed detrimental to "economic or national interests," when they do not behave like good citizens in their own country, when they have broken Mexican laws, and when "they are not found to be physically or mentally healthy." (Article 37)
5. The Secretary of Governance may "suspend or prohibit the admission of foreigners when he
determines it to be in the national interest." (Article 38)
6. Mexican authorities must keep track of every single person in the country:
7. Federal, local and municipal police must cooperate with federal immigration authorities upon request, i.e., to assist in the arrests of illegal immigrants. (Article 73)
8. A National Population Registry keeps track of "every single individual who comprises the population of the country," and verifies each individual's identity. (Articles 85 and 86)
9. A national Catalog of Foreigners tracks foreign tourists and immigrants (Article 87), and assigns each individual with a unique tracking number (Article 91).
10. Foreigners with fake papers, or who enter the country under false pretenses, may be imprisoned:
11. Foreigners with fake immigration papers may be fined or imprisoned. (Article 116)
12. Foreigners who sign government documents "with a signature that is false or different from that which he normally uses" are subject to fine and imprisonment. (Article 116)
13. Foreigners who fail to obey the rules will be fined, deported, and/or imprisoned as felons:
14. Foreigners who fail to obey a deportation order are to be punished. (Article 117)
15. Foreigners who are deported from Mexico and attempt to re-enter the country without authorization can be imprisoned for up to 10 years. (Article 118)
16. Foreigners who violate the terms of their visa may be sentenced to up to six years in prison (Articles 119, 120 and 121). Foreigners who misrepresent the terms of their visa while in Mexico -- such as working with out a permit -- can also be imprisoned.
17. Under Mexican law, illegal immigration is a felony. The General Law on Population says,
"A penalty of up to two years in prison and a fine of three hundred to five thousand pesos will be imposed on the foreigner who enters the country illegally." (Article 123)
18. Foreigners with legal immigration problems may be deported from Mexico instead of being imprisoned. (Article 125)
19. Foreigners who "attempt against national sovereignty or security" will be deported. (Article 126)
Mexicans who help illegal aliens enter the country are themselves considered criminals under the law:
20. A Mexican who marries a foreigner with the sole objective of helping the foreigner live in the country is subject to up to five years in prison. (Article 127)
21. Shipping and airline companies that bring undocumented foreigners into Mexico will be fined. (Article 132)
I numbered the above points so you can discuss them more easily in COMMENTS.....and I hope you do. Imagine if WE respected ourselves enough to have laws like these? Meanwhile, our country's being destroyed by illegals and a sitting president thinks it's 'misguided' to enforce our laws (check the difference between Arizona's law and Federal Law.......I think you'll be surprised at how similar they are) And Leftwingers still wonder why "they" (those socialist nonAmericans the left's enamored with) don't like us...when we don't respect ourselves, why should "they?" "They" see Jerry Springer on many European television channels, they see a country which elected a president who apologizes for our greatness and strength and dumps on our long-time allies, and they see we don't even protect our own borders.............and they're supposed to RESPECT US let along LIKE US?!!!

By the way, I think they forgot one:
22. If any Mexican is trafficking drugs or making other kinds of trouble, or if we can't keep supporting them, send them to America. (and, please, leftwingers, don't even suggest I'm against Mexicans...this has everything to do with behavior and sovereignty.......and, by the way, every Mexican American I KNOW is more for the Arizona laws than even I am........)


Ducky's here said...

Well, the deal is that Mexico has lots of cheap labor, excess cheap labor and that labor is in demand in the U.S.,not Mexico. Rather simple.

Now, if you were a corn farmer in Mexico who was driven out of farming by NAFTA you might see this differently. Of course, the right can only see illegals as leeches. True in some cases but hardly in the majority.

It's always about how put upon is American white bread.

Brooke said...

There goes Ducky with his cognitively disordered racism again. What a sock.

OF COURSE the hypocritical and corrupt Mexican gov't is protesting AZ's new law!

Why deal with the dregs and the poor when they can send them here and let US go bankrupt doing it?

Z said...

So, what do I do, Ducky? Delete because you've not only got it wrong but are so insulting? Would you keep your comment here?
I don't really mind a good argument except for the belittling stuff you always have to throw in. Are you afraid your comments don't hold on their own?

Could you just stick to the POST? Do you see a problem with the fact that Mexican laws are tougher than American? I know you're eager to have the illegals here because your side will be giving them voting rights any time now..and weak, 'give it to me' types will ONLY vote your way so I can't be surprised because you never put America first, but I do, and I want to think our laws are at least as tough as Mexico's...
hilarious is how Mexico's put out travel warnings for AZ.
Wish they'd done that 100 years ago.

beamish said...

Ducky shits himself every time a black man walks though his lily white neighborhood.

Misfit410 said...

It's a bit radical but, we could always legalize drugs and end the corruption in the Mexican police and government, kill organized crime and cut 90% of street crime all in one shot..

Hey I hate drugs, but if Artsy liberals want to kill themselves with smack, who am I to stop them?

Z said...

The State of California's considering boycotting Arizona for this law. this Californian knows this law is the right thing to do..if nothing more than to get the federal government to DO SOMETHING.
Funny that Napolitano was all for tighter actions against illegals while gov of AZ and now, as Obama's homeland security figurehead lackey, drags her feet.
Funny how McCain was all for amnesty until he realized Arizonans are sick of being treated this badly by illegals ...
The Left's now into their Alinsky-esque stuff of how this will be "bad for Republicans" during the election! Oh, sure..73% agree with the law and McCain's focus groups obviously show that's WRONG...but the Left (that'd be OUR MEDIA) keeps it up...drip drip drip drip.......


beamish said...

I'll one up you Misfit.

Legalize drugs and criminalize drug treatment centers.

Let the generation that will burn themselves out do so in the gutter as a sort of real-world display to point at and say with honesty "drugs are bad, mmmkay."

The demand for drugs will fall.

FrogBurger said...

Ducky is another example of the victimhood mindset. It's always our fault. Not the fault of the Mexican government and their policies.

Little whimp, duckette.

Maybe you should try to immigrate to Mexico. That would be a relief for us. Oh wait, they want people that can contribute.

Z said...

Ducky, maybe that'll help. Find out where you get your wrong information; it might help you. That's an excellent article Elbro alerted me to. We can all learn by it; too bad our mainstream media won't.

Ducky's here said...

What do you do, z? Well first I'd admit that the general attitude towards immigrants does not admit that many of them are simply seeking a way out of being poor.

The Mexican immigration laws aren't particularly relevant in this case. There isn't any push to go to Mexico for jobs.

Let's start with this thesis. A LARGE number of Mexican illegals were farmers who were pushed off their farms by NAFTA. Now Monsanto, Cargill, Archer-Daniels can produce plenty of cheap corn to put cheap high fructose corn syrup in the food supply... and as a bonus generate immigration and health care problems.

I am saying that if the Baggers aren't asking questions about what causes this migration then they aren't going to be very successful about solutions.

And I will continue to maintain that they really only get concerned because of a perceived cost to themselves, not the issues in the wider economic system.

I think Beamish and Misfit adequately demonstrate the level of "thought" on the right and maybe that will help you understand why the right comes in for ridicule when they try to propose solutions.

Z said...


you say "What do you do, z? Well first I'd admit that the general attitude towards immigrants does not admit that many of them are simply seeking a way out of being poor."

Great, so they come break US financially because they hate being poor in their own country?

Tea Party members are tired of all of it, won't listen and I don't see why.

Do you have a shred of sympathy for Americans through all the nastiness of illegals who take advantage of this country?
Does it occur to you there just might be a problem when cars get stopped for traffic violations and cops find tons of guns and ammo and the driver's an illegal Mexican?

And why is it that it only takes 200 nutty Americans ( to get the left nervous but thousands of Mexicans in our jails and even more out there committing crimes and otherwise causing problems in America, like murder, get a pass?

Misfit410 said...

I hate to break it to you Ducky, but I'm not "On the Right", I'm a classical Liberal.

I have a very basic belief, I want the government to have as little of my money and as little influence over my personal life as humanly possible..

so bite me you lonely moronic miser.

beamish said...

I think Beamish and Misfit adequately demonstrate the level of "thought" on the right and maybe that will help you understand why the right comes in for ridicule when they try to propose solutions.

Oh we just do so very hope one day the left will stop munching crayons and smile at the right with Easter-egg speckled teeth long enough to not ridicule one of of our ideas before going back to coloring Hitler mustaches on pictures of Michelle Bachmann.

Dreamers, we rightists.

Ducky's here said...

Ah Misfit, the classic victim of the cult of the individual.

Carry on. Say hi to John Locke for me.

Z said...

You know, Ducky, I seriously do wonder if you can't argue the facts so you have to get belittling and then get self righteous and nasty back when you're called on it?

Ducky's here said...

Tea Party members are tired of all of it, won't listen and I don't see why.

Whether the Baggers are tired of it or not is completely irrelevant. You can voice your impotence all you like and whine that you aren't being listened too.

Back to basics. Until we understand the reason for the migration we aren't going to be very successful stopping it. Part of that involves understanding who benefits and with a little thought you will also realize they don't give a damn if you're tired of it or not.

And if all you see are people trying to "take advantage of you" then you're doomed to thrash around with absolutely no understanding of why this is happening and yes, the Baggers will continued to be laughed at because they are way behind in understanding why this is happening and who it benefits.

By the way, in regards to Mexico's laws. Lot of seniors go down their to get a break on health care costs. I'm sure you are aware of that but ignore it's inconvenient relationship to your thesis.

z, time to admit that America is just another nation on the bus. These problems are complicated and simply assuming that everyone wants to take America's stuff so we need lots of military and police is not going to get you anywhere. China already owns a lot of our stuff anyway. Happened while you were bowing down to Saint Ronnie Raygun.

Z said...

Ducky, I don't disagree with everything you'd be surprised, actually.

The facts are that my point is that we need to stop illegal immigration and I wish we had laws with teeth and actually enforced our laws like Mexico does....Mexico has some drugs we don't and people are going there for them but they're not approved, you go if you like, I won't.....and yes, oldsters go to Mexico but they can't buy land ...i don't really care if you agree with me or not on any of this and I will remind you again that insults don't lend themselves to honest discourse.
And, anybody who honestly believes Americans are going to lay down and die as we turn into just 'another nation on the bus' (being thrown UNDER the bus by the jerk Obama) is NUTS.

It was when we were great and stood up for ourselves and our allies that nobody treated us like we are being treated now....skinny little pirates with slingshots wouldn't have ever dreamt of hijacking American navy ships under Reagan, Iran and N Korea wouldn't be shaking their sabers if liberals like you weren't of the mind that "Well, we have nukes, why shouldn't THEY?" (and I have no proof Obama wouldn't feel like that if he at least had SOME wisdom in his group warning him against that stupidity)

No, Ducky..there are Americans who don't feel like you do, and we're well aware of NAFTA's problems ..and I'm not assuming everyone wants our stuff, I KNOW they want our stuff. OPen your eyes.
Also, our stuff is for the taking to those who need it and who'd followed our laws.

Ducky's here said...

Mexico has some drugs we don't and people are going there for them but they're not approved


That's a very narrow understanding. Seniors go for medical procedures that are much less expensive. You can find this all in the nasty mainstream media. I don't think Beck has mentioned it.

I point it out because the right has a very limited understanding of issues and as our nation collapses they wish to hold on to a belief that Reaganism was not a serious factor in the decline and they want to hold on, against all rational belief, to this idea of exceptionalism.

But I'll ask again, if NAFTA allowed American agribusiness to profit at the expense of small Mexican farmers and China is taking jobs because they have even cheaper labor then just what do you think is going to happen and why do you think you can claim to be the only one with a grievance in this complicated matter?

Dave Miller said...

As one who works, serves, and lives in Mexico for a significant part of each year, I can say that while there may indeed be strong laws on the books, reality is much different.

There are in fact many people living illegally in Mexico from countries around the world, including the United States.

As long as you stay out of trouble and pay your bills, the Mexican law enforcement community leaves you alone, legal, or illegal.

So while the laws on the books look tough, they are in fact and practice, about as effective as our federal laws.

As for Ducky, he does make a good point.

Why is it cheaper for Maria to buy corn for masa/tortillas from someone selling US corn than someone selling Mexican corn?

Because the US supports a basement price on corn prices here in the US. That means Bill can sell his corn for next to nothing, and he still gets top dollar here in the states. Courtesy of our government. [How's that for socialism?]

But his corn can then be brokered in Mexico, and around the world below market, thus wiping out local indigenous farmers.

I have seen it first hand and it is one reason many Mexican farmers have given up farming in their own country and try to come here, legally, or illegally.

Anonymous said...

We are being invaded by foreign nationals and an invasion is an act of war.

It is not illegal to shoot enemy invaders on sight.

It matters not that Mexicans aren’t infiltrating our country armed and in uniform if the end results (occupation and conquest) are the same.

The only way to drive them out and keep them out is to take up arms against them.

And as sure as you’re born; it will happen.

Virtually every other option to drive them out and keep them out has been tried and failed miserably…

If this isn't true....then why are they calling for troops on the border? To hug the worms?

Z said...

Dave, you said "As long as you stay out of trouble and pay your bills, the Mexican law enforcement community leaves you alone, legal, or illegal."
That worked here for many years with Mexicans, too.
it's sort of like muslims...who CARED about having them here until the troubles they've caused?
Who really cared about having Mexicans here until the trouble with drugs and crime and gangs and, now, destroying our economy?
And who caused these problems...AMERICANS?

I have ALWAYS been of the mind that, if we must, helping them THERE in MX would be better than their sneaking in here and costing us even more than our help would be there.
I also greatly resent silos of food being stored here and rotting...that should go to the poor somewhere.
The LAST THING I support is hurting indigenous farmers and that has to be fixed.

Ducky...tell me a more EXCEPTIONAL country.
Seniors go for procedures and I didn't know that? REALLY?
you go have work there, I have heard too many horror stories among the good stories. And, then, you're stuck there with no recourse...

Anonymous; they'd shoot us on sight but we need to never hurt back, because "WE'RE BETTER THAN THEY ARE" (and yes, a lot of sarcasm I live in LA and have a better understanding of LA RAZA than most Americans's horrifying and I'm hearing friends tell me their gardeners who've been with them for years are quitting and warning of coming insurrection) BUt, we have to be nice. (what the hell happened to America?)

Misfit410 said...

Ducky you don't think the fact the the US government subsidizes corn to get it at those prices has more to do with wiping out the farmers than free trade?

Way to take the consequences of your own stupid policies and and blame them on something completely unrelated.

Z said...

good point ,Misfit.

Ducky, you know, I've been thinking how much more ideological you are than I am...or many of the conservatives here.
I wouldn't have thought so because I'm a pretty hard core Conservative, but I think you'd be surprised about some of my opinions I don't share here because people like you'd jump on them and make conclusions which would be wrong..
I don't think you have a pro American, pro conservative thought in your head or heart.

Ducky's here said...

Ruining our economy? You just got someone agreeing with the serious destruction NAFTA has caused Mexican farmers and all you can think of is yourself?

More exceptional, let's start with Canada. Just to get things hot. I'm not sure what you mean by exceptional but I think it has something to do with going really deep into debt so we can buy lots of stuff and running an internal economy based on cheap oil which causes a lot of disruption but yeah, we produce all the freedom in the world. Stop, z.

I do enjoy the post that thinks we should shoot on sight. Stunning. However, please not that I don't believe the average Bagger is quite that mentally disturbed.

Anonymous said...

"are quitting and warning of coming insurrection"

Then let the games begin. Let's show the country when Phoenix gets torched by illegals...what a propensity for criminality and violence they have...not peaceful or legal! Arizonan's just fired the first warning shot at them. Perhaps they'll get more backbone and shoot back.

And the citizens of Arizona will then have a legitimate reason to use force. I wonder if Obama will send in troops to arrest the legal citizens of Arizona then?

Let the games begin...we'll know who started it long ago with an illegal invasion of the country.

Illegals don't want law enforcement.

Z said...

"all you can think of is yourself?"

and, could you stop looking at this argument as Z vs SOCIALISM? this is AMERICA v EVIL and SOCIALISM.

I just can't see everything as black/white as you do....not on this topic.

As for America ...yes, EXCEPTIONAL, the place where every immigrant would give his eye teeth to go to....or HAVE COME TO before the left started our slide into socialism. Ducky, let's make this about YOU, why do YOU think everyone I happen to know from any E European country is voting AGAINST Obama's RICH PAY THE POOR crap? Oh, I know, your family likes socialism, but I'm talking about the normal, America-loving person, the person who felt relief upon his arrival here..until now.

And, again, you never tell me which country is MORE EXCEPTIONAL..I"ll wait. I have to go now and so you'll have a little more time to think.

It's sad that people actually have to even consider shooting on sight (which is a very rare suggestion anywhere, by the way)...who'd have thought Americans would have made it this easy to screw ourselves by allowing what's been happening on the borders for years. Bush is as responsible as anyone, but you'll make it ALL ABOUT BUSH, so I really shouldn't say that.

Anonymous. people like Ducky don't care if Phoenix gets torched, but let Guadalajara get torched and it'll be EVIL AMERICA. wait for it.l

beamish said...

All that "cheap oil" importing - over half of which comes from Canada and Mexico...

Please, Ducky. Economics aren't your forte. Make balloon animals or something.

WomanHonorThyself said...

the libs just want us all defenseless immoral is that!!!

Z said...

"make balloon animals or something"...Beamish, I SO needed a laugh, Thanks!

LASunsett said...

//Of course, the right can only see illegals as leeches.//

The left only sees them as votes.

LASunsett said...

//Please, Ducky. Economics aren't your forte. Make balloon animals or something.//

Rule #1

Never read Beamish's comments with a full bladder.

(I made it, but it was close.)

Z said...

LASUNSETT...Beamish is hilarious, isn't he? I know what you mean..!!
Glad to see you and yes, love your comment re VOTES. that's ALL it is.

heidianne jackson said...

misfit, i would lov to "...end the corruption in the Mexican police and government..." however, legalization of drugs of alone won't do it.

beamish, i think making balloon animals may be as taxing for ducky as economics.

look, nafta sucks. it's a horrible pact, um, who passed that again? oh that's right, bubba. dave, you're spot on about the in the socialism that corporate socialism that has been expanded here in the u.s. because of this terrible treaty. but simply turning our heads to illegal immigration is NOT the answer.

ducky, we DO understand the cause of illegal immigration: people who are in country a want to better their situation - regardless of the reason claimed. they look around and identify country b as a place to do that. then rather than going through LEGAL channels to enter country - either because they don't think they'll get in, or they can't meet the financial criteria, or they simply don't want to wait for approval - they simply cross the border ILLEGALLY and "set down roots".

it's really that simple. and that complicated.

we are a sovereign nation. we get to say who can be in this country or not - just like every other country in the world. there's a reason that our illegal AND legal immigration numbers are so much higher than anywhere in the world. it's because of the freedoms that people still believe we have here - including a truly free market - AND because of the handouts we give to everyone even those here illegally.

dave, i know that not all of those who are in mexico illegally have these laws enforced upon them. but according to several watch groups (including amnesty international) their record is much higher than our. and the human rights abuses of those they catch there illegally (or helping those who are there illegally) by mexican authorities is atrocious.

if the abuses being visited upon those illegal aliens in mexico were being visited upon illegal aliens here in the united states, the international fallout woud be loud, forceful and immediate. as it should be.

until the people of the world stop holding the united states to a separate standard than the rest of the world, the liberals will continue to be able to say we're bad. i'd say "screw 'em, they're idiots" except that they control the media at this point and the educational system and those in turn play a large part in determining how people vote.

Ducky's here said...

All that "cheap oil" importing - over half of which comes from Canada and Mexico...


Hey dipstick, it's fungible. What matters is keeping the aggregate demand price down.

You really are something. Best to go sit at the home with LA and reminisce about invading Grenada and preserving our freedoms.

Pitch till you win, even if it takes as long as I think it will.

Elmers Brother said...

Tea Party members are tired of all of it, won't listen and I don't see why.

According to Rasmussen 77% of Conservatives agree with new law in Arizona

62% of libertarians and independents and 50% of democrats

this isn't an ideological right/left argument

heidianne jackson said...

sorry for all my typos, y'all. sometimes i think faster than i can type. ugh!

Elmers Brother said...

dispelling the myths

Anonymous said...

"In remarks delivered in July 2008, then-candidate Obama announced to a crowd of La Raza supporters, "Make no mistake about it—the Latino community holds this election in your hands. ... I know how powerful this community is. Together, we won't just win an election; we will transform this nation."

And clearly they believe they have a mandate and a duty to forment violence. As if Barry hasn't egged them on again with recent remaks.....excluding right thinking Americans. I don't know how we can avoid a showdown any longer. To me...the die is cast. It's as clear to me as a firefight in Mosul.

I hope Arizonians have the guts to boycott all things Mexican in retaliation. And those who want to boycott Arizona? Nice move idiots....there'll be thousands of illegals fired from hotels, resorts and landscaping. We should be able to see the line of illegals heading back from google earth.


Anonymous said...

Arizona based their law on our own federal law. There's nothing outrageous about it at all.

It's simply that Arizona is determined to enforce it, where the feds are not.

I think I know where Arizona made their mistake. After reading Mexico's immigration laws, AZ should have based theirs on Mexico's. Now wouldn't that be interesting?

"Well first I'd admit that the general attitude towards immigrants does not admit that many of them are simply seeking a way out of being poor."

Ducky, you left off the word illegal when speaking about "immigrants". I'm sure that was just an oversight, right?

And another thing, "we're just another nation on the bus"? We're nothing special is that it?

So, see if you can find a bus going south, will you? I'm sure they'll be happy to have you.


Janie Lynn said...

Sometimes I just have to skip past Ducky's comments. Ugh. But I do want to say that America will always be as exceptional as we make it. If you want to be as mediocre as most of Europe these days Ducky, continue your line of thinking and blind following of liberal ideals. You're right, America will not be exceptional anymore.

LASunsett said...

//Best to go sit at the home with LA and reminisce about invading Grenada and preserving our freedoms.//

Actually, Grenada is the furthest thing from my mind. I am focused on not letting an Evan Bayh retirement go to waste and fall into the hands of Brad Ellsworth.

Besides, I think you used that weak retort on me a couple of months ago. At least try to keep the insanity packed into some fresh prose, will you?

LASunsett said...

//Sometimes I just have to skip past Ducky's comments.//


Sometimes when Beamish is not able to make us laugh, Ducky always does manage to come through in a pinch.

I think does a great job of satirizing himself.. even though he doesn't mean to.

Janie Lynn said...

True that, LASunsett.

Deborah on the Bayside said...

So, does this mean that the Mexican government doesn't set up water stations in the Sonoran desert and publish English pamplets to help Americans in their quest for [illegal] work in Mexico?

Seriously, if I were a poor man in Mexico I'd do whatever it took to get here. Sure, there's a lot of scum that sneaks in, and I'd like to see some pretty tight controls to vomit out the malefactors (cheers to Arizona for adopting the federal ordinance so they can take over enforcement duties from the feds who are AWOL), but if a guy wants a job ... he goes where the jobs (and free education and free healthcare) are. Especially if he doesn't even have to learn the language!

While I am a bugbear on Monsanto, their crummy corn, HFCS and the dreadful and unwelcome trend to substitute that garbage for sugar in Mexican soft drinks (I know Mexicans who rebel at the taste alone) -- this problem started long before.

And it runs deep -- to the marrow of a civilization that is embarrassed over their own exceptional culture, standards and achievements and is instead lapsing into the ways of the Apologist in Chief.

beamish said...

Hey dipstick, it's fungible. What matters is keeping the aggregate demand price down.

And the United Stats getting over half of its imported oil through Canada and Mexico (via NAFTA, yo) works to keep the aggregate demand price down (and less money to the Middle East Gulf states as well)

What are you arguing for? Crude oil liquidity rather than fungibility?

You really are something. Best to go sit at the home with LA and reminisce about invading Grenada and preserving our freedoms.

Well now I'm totally convinced of your economic expertise. Not.

Pitch till you win, even if it takes as long as I think it will.

Is that a gay porn reference?

Oh c'mon Ducky. Even on steroids you won't come out in the rain. Afeared the pruny will get ya.

Z said...

Beamish! "Pitch till you win, even if it takes as long as I think it will.
Is that a gay porn reference?"

Oh, I LOVE to laugh at your comments...!!!!!! Thanks!