Wednesday, April 2, 2014

Jonathan Pollard

Do we set Pollard free so Israel will release Palestinian criminals so Palestine will go to the table with Israel and us?

What do you think?  From THIS article comes the following:

Securing Pollard's release would help Netanyahu sell a package that would include more releases of Palestinian prisoners — something that would otherwise be unpopular with his hard-line Cabinet.

A number of senior officials have already come out against further releases, and Netanyahu's coalition is dominated by lawmakers sympathetic to the West Bank settler movement.

Netanyahu's Housing Minister, Uri Ariel, said he would oppose Pollard's release if it is linked to freedom for Palestinian prisoners convicted of killing Israelis.

"Israel must not release murderers. Israel shouldn't reach such a deal," Ariel, from the hard-line Jewish Home party, told Army Radio. "Pollard deserves any other deal in order to be released."

Ariel also said Pollard himself opposes being freed in exchange for Palestinian prisoners, citing people close to the U.S. spy who conveyed Pollard's stance.

So???   You think many Palestinian prisoners should be released for one spy?   Would you release him?



Constitutional Insurgent said...

Pollard violated the tenets of his security clearance, including his Non-Dislcoure Agreement and collateral read-ons. I would not release him.

Israel often asks for his early release, but I've always wondered why. He appeared to have no pure affinity for around his services to three other countries prior to Israel.

Ed Bonderenka said...

One man released from prison to forward a deal endangering a nation?
Even Pollard knows better.

Political Junky said...

Z said...
Sue, it's apparently not HIM (Dave) who left that comment, that's all.

After a little bit of investigation work, I found that it's true it was not Dave that left that comment.
HOWEVER it WAS a copy and paste job of a post that DAVE DID post on another blog.
So the bottom line IS that HE DID write it but on another blog.

Joe said...

I'm all for this. Not a fan of Israel in general, but Pollard got an excessive sentence for spying for an allied country.
Robert Kim, an American Citizen who spied for South Korea, was only given 9 years and was released after 7.
First of all, Pollard was not found guilty of spying on the US but rather of passing our spying results regarding Israel's Mideast neighbors on to Israel.

Pollard has done his time and should be released. He was rightly jailed but with him no longer being any threat as a spy any more and with probably nearly half his life gone I don;t see any reason not to release him
So one has to ask, did Pollard get an excessive sentence because he spied for Israel?

Always On Watch said...

I'm totally ignorant about this topic. I wasn't the least bit politically aware back when the Pollard Case was major news.

Offhand, based on what I know now, I'm with CI on this.

Question: Didn't Pollard sell the secrets for money and not out of conviction?

Anonymous said...

The Most Un-American Speech
Barack Obama Has Ever Delivered
Would you expect a "pro American" speech from Fidel Castro? Hugo Chavez? Mahmoud Ahmadinejad? Osama bin Laden?
Before getting to the speech itself, it’s worth noting a few things.
When the Democrats passed and Barack Obama signed Obamacare, the majority opposed it. About 56%, in fact. A majority have consistently opposed that law ever since.

The Obama administration touted 7 million sign-ups by March 31 as “success.” When that goal appeared to be unreachable, the administration suggested that maybe 5 or 6 million would be enough. Now, as if by magic, they have their number. Somehow.

All along, the administration has touted false numbers of enrollees. All along, the administration has neglected to admit that Obamacare is causing millions of Americans to lose their insurance, as they were forced to admit that they knew it would.

A simple bit of math shows that even if there are 7 million legitimate sign-ups, there are between 5 and 6 million who lost their healthcare because of Obamacare. What’s the net number? How many of these have even paid their premiums? And how many of them are now facing steeper deductibles?Premiums are not going down. Access has not been expanded. Provider networks are shrinking, reducing choice. These are all consequences of Obamacare. The president mentioned none of it.

The Obama administration is also neglecting to admit that their law is killing jobs. It is strangling hiring. It is killing the work ethic that built this country. The CBO estimates that we will lose the equivalent of more than 2 million jobs’ worth of work hours. Small businesses say that Obamacare is keeping them from expanding their businesses, and keeping them from hiring and growing their workforces. They also say that Obamacare is forcing them to cut hours, which translates into lost wages, for millions of workers. Obama mentioned none of that.
But most importantly, the Obama administration is not admitting that it used naked, brute force to coerce Americans into signing up for Obamacare. Failing to sign up can get the IRS, with its auditors and armed agents, unleashed on you. When faced with that prospect, sure, it’s not all that hard to persuade people to do what you want. It’s a lesson that feudal chiefs, tyrants, pirates and bandits learned a long time ago.

Anonymous said...

The 7 million that President Obama touted today is a false number, he knows that it is a false number, and he knows that it is based on the threat of force. In fact, his administration couldn’t even give a solid number until today. How convenient.

So today, the day after the same administration that has cooked the books on deportations, and cooked the books on unemployment, the same administration that lied about Fast and Furious, lied about Benghazi, lied about “green jobs,” lied about last week’s meeting with the Pope, and whose IRS abused the president’s critics — the leader of that administration touted “7.1 million sign-ups” for Obamacare. Even going by the administration’s official numbers, the president’s claim is inflated. The administration only claims 7,041,000 — far from 7.1 million.

The president criticized Americans who donated their own money to run ads opposing Obamacare. But Barack Obama used government force to take Americans’ money and use that money to promote his law — whether we backed his law or not. Which is worse?

Obama said that now that his law is the law of the land, it cannot be repealed. Also false. It’s unpopular even before the employer mandate kicks in, which is destined to cost tens of millions of Americans the healthcare that they now have. We have a system by which laws and even amendments to the Constitution can be repealed.

But the most ghastly aspect of the president’s speech was its celebratory tone. This president stood in the Rose Garden in the lawn of the people’s house. He used force to coerce Americans into doing what he wants for the sake of politics and power. An American president should never celebrate taking freedoms away from Americans. This president has, and he is pleased with himself for doing it. He basks in the applause of those who celebrate with him, as if it’s an achievement to use the full force of government to impose yourself on others.

Outside the gates of his little ceremony, Democrats remain on the run because Obamacare is wreaking havoc on people’s lives. This president’s “mission accomplished” moment has come. The Democrats will still lose the Senate this year, in part because Barack Obama remains so out of touch, aloof, and dishonest.

Frida Van der Wiener said...

We should have put Pollard against a wall and shot him to rags. Same goes for Kim, and any other POS who betrays us by passing on state secrets entrusted to their care.

Does anyone in their right mind believe this will advance us one step toward that great chimera, 'Peace in the Middle East?'

Islam doesn't release white doves, it wield the flaming sword of Allah, and Israel's presence in Muslim land is a never-ending source of outrage and focus of muslim hatred.

There will never be peace in the Middle East. Push all the Joooos into the sea, and the muslims will return to slashing, bombing and setting one another on fire.

We should have carved an Israel out of post-WWII Germany, since they were the ones who did so much harm. The whole bit about 'Land God gave them' is moot anyway. Half of Israel is agnostic or atheist, and most of the rest rarely go to synagogue.

Anonymous said...

Frida, you are an idiot

Not in My Name said...

Hey Freida Va Putz,
Did you say that when Cinton was giving our secrets to the Chinese?

Duckys here said...

The traitorous scum Pollard should rot but he's part of the farce we call an Israeli peace process.

Obama will continue full support for our fine allies in the region, Israel and Saudi Arabia and nothing changes.

Anonymous said...

Scum? You must have him confused with Obama

The gallant warrior said...

Ducky Von Schmuck, you have your Scumbags mixed up. The Scumbag in Chief is the real traitor

Frida Van der Wiener said...

Ed: Please rebut the argument or show where I am factually incorrect.

Not in My Name: Dirty Clintonites who sold our secrets to China should have been shot as well. I never said otherwise.

JonBerg said...

"Do we set Pollard free so Israel will release Palestinian criminals so Palestine will go to the table with Israel and us?"

NO! The only result that I see is that there would just be more criminals back on the street. If the Palestinians [really] wanted to go to the "table" they would, irrespective of such an exchange.

Anonymous said...

PEW Research Center: More white evangelicals than American Jews say God gave Israel to the Jewish people

Z said...

I need to run this morning and will be back soon.

I just quickly glanced at your comments (thanks for coming by) but I will have to say I found it telling that even Pollard says he shouldn't be released for this exchange. Curious, if he's just in it for himself, isn't it.

viburnum said...

@Joe "Pollard has done his time and should be released."

As long as you're feeling magnanimous maybe we should let Walker and Whitworth go as well? I see no distinction between them.

Sam Huntington said...

I have to say that I view prison sentences for scum like Pollard in the same way I regard “apologies.” An apology doesn’t take back or remove whatever it was that we found offensive. I’m sick and tired of listening to people apologize for comments they made, and by the frequency of these apologies, it is clear that even though rendered, the apologist didn’t mean it. Can you believe, for example, that the US apologized for using the atomic bomb on Japan?

Pollard was sent to prison; I want to know why he wasn’t shot as a spy? Uncivilized, you say? How civilized is it to toss this traitor into a prison so that he can become a butt muffin for someone like Ducky? I say give them their day in court, and when found guilty, line ‘em up against the wall and be done with it.

Release Palestinians? Are you kidding me? Shoot those bastards too ...

Anonymous said...

Shoot the FREAKEN Palistinians , is the best I heard all day !

Duckys here said...

Is there any reason we shouldn't get involved in this really cynical game of arresting people, calling them suspected militants, giving them a show trial and then releasing them years later as part of the completely fake peace process(LMAO)?

I call this sucker theater.

Baysider said...

No and yes, but for other reasons.

Since the 'peace process' has long been a farce in the Middle East, why dignify it with anything other than the undignified boob Kerry who no one takes seriously.

Sam Huntington said...

Aw jeez, Baysider. Did you have to equate Kerry to boobs?

Z said...

Sam, that is HILARIOUS! I'm laughing so hard! :-) GOOD ONE

Ducky, what ARE you talking about?>

Baysider...since everyone on the planet with a brain knows this 'peace negotiation' with Kerry will go no further than the Palestinians have let it go any time in the last 50 years, to release this guy's a TOTAL joke.

Ed, which part of Frida's rant is 'idiotic' to you...? I'm interested.

Anonymous, I have no interest in reading your link after seeing the title, but so what? That makes Evangelicals wrong?
DO you KNOW how many particularly young Jews hate Israel? That's just plain well known. Liberal guilt and misinformation from liberal profs have contributed to this.

A Tea Party Patriot said...

Here is a fact for you a-holes like Ducky!....Jonathan Pollard, was never accused, indicted or convicted of treason in a court of law. However, Jonathan has been repeatedly defamed in the media, falsely accused of treason and wrongly branded a "traitor" by those who, incredibly, claim to have no hostile agenda, but really do.

Pollard was indicted on one charge only: one count of passing classified information to an ally without intent to harm the United States. There were no additional charges against him. Jonathan is the only person in the history of the US to receive a life sentence for spying for an ally.

Silverfiddle said...

Tea Party Patriot:

The POS Pollard, like Kim, Manning, Snowden and others, is a traitor to his country. He sold secrets entrusted to him, and the went to not just Israel, but the Soviet Union, among other enemy countries.

Reagan should have put him in front of a firing squad.

John Jamerson said...

In my estimation, Jonathan Pollard got an excessive sentence for spying for an allied country. For example, Robert Kim, an American Citizen who spied for South Korea, was only given 9 years and was released after 7 years.
Jonathan Pollard never had a trial. At the request of both the U.S. and Israeli governments, he entered into a plea agreement, which spared both governments a long, difficult, expensive and potentially embarrassing trial.
Jonathan Pollard admitted guilt and forfeited a trial because the prosecutor offered him a plea deal. Americans who spied for unfriendly powers were out of prison in about 5-6 years at that time. The judge threw out the plea deal and sentenced Pollard to life in prison in violation of the plea deal and denying Pollard his constitutional right to fair trial. He has served almost 30 years in prison. Has he not been punished? I know you want the Jew to be burned at the stake or in an oven like in old good days - that would be the proper punishment for him in your opinion......

John Jamerson said...

Did Bill Clinton sold China nuclear secrets in exchange for campaign money? You bet your ass he did!

Bill Clinton created a more dangerous world because he and the liberal Democrats don't believe America has the moral authority to be the world’s lone superpower!

Z said...

John Jamerson...WHO wants "the Jew to be burned at the STAKE?!" Not THIS (MY) blog, BELIEVE me.

I have always felt Pollard's sentence was huge and, as you say, particularly from an ally country. I guess my thought is "better spy for Israel than for Iran!"

Tea Party said "without intent to harm the United States"...
is that true?

But isn't it wrong to spy in any way? He absolutely betrayed us, apparently.

And I think Silverfiddle's point about the others is a good one.

Constitutional Insurgent said...

If one willfully violates the entrustment of an SCI security clearance [access to the most sensitive information], it doesn't matter if they are spying for Canada. They broke the sacred trust to their country and it's people.

Forget just Israel....Pollard disclosed classified information to Australia and South Africa...and that' just what's known publicly.There is more information that has not been approved for release to the public, since his incraceration.

There's also the matter of Israel refusing to return the bulk of what Pollard passed to them.

Frida Van der Wiener said...

There's also the matter of America's 'ally' Israel spying on us and stealing our secrets.

Duckys here said...

Well, CI, Israel was a strong ally of South Africa's so he was just showing his allegiance.

z, if you saying you aren't familiar with Israel's habit of rounding up "suspected militants" to be used as bargaining chips to gain concessions in the "peace process"?
Little naive, no?

Ed Bonderenka said...

I'm not defending Pollard, but he did get screwed in his sentencing, whether you feel he should be shot or not.
His information to Israel regarding Saddam's development of chemical weapons and Scud delivery systems allowed Israel to prepare her citizenry with gas masks for all (Palestinian and Jew).
Remember Desert Storm?

Bob said...

I'm in the same boat as AOW.That's probably not a bad place to be, either.

I believe this is a prime example of why we need to trust our elected leadership. The reason is this: Most citizens have little knowledge of the Pollard case, and probably don't understand why the guy is in prison rather than being executed.

The real problem today is that we have no reason to trust the judgement of our leadership, especially including that famous anti-American, John Kerry and his equally anti-American boss, Barack Obama.

In these cases we usually trust that our diplomats will operate to the benefit of the United States. Unfortunately, that is not the case. You can't trust those guys, at all.

Bob said...

Ed sayeth, "His information to Israel regarding Saddam's development of chemical weapons and Scud delivery systems allowed Israel to prepare her citizenry with gas masks for all (Palestinian and Jew)."

I have always found the Israeli chemical gas masks to be most interesting. They bought thousands and thousands on the basis that Saddam had chemical weapons. I don't think the Israelis got this totally from us. I do remember that the Israeli government was harshly criticized by their citizenry for buying all those masks. So, even the Mosad thought Saddam had WMD. How quickly we forget.

Z said...

Thanks, CI.

No, Ducky....I just don't look for the Jews to always be doing something wrong like you do.
I'm just positive the Arabs NEVER do anything like that, right?
They just kill children and grandparents on buses.

Bob...good point. I'm thinking the very famous and effective Mosad doesn't get too much wrong, huh?
As for our leadership; Each time I have to see Obama, I have to see in my mind's eye that picture of Obama the punk with the hat on, joint in hand, eyelids lowered from being makes me want to poke an ice pick in my mind's eye! (a line I LOVE from EVERYBODY LOVES RAYMOND!)
And THAT's the man whose hands our lives are in.


Z said...

CNN and MSNBC have mentioned how awful it is when so many people there have guns on them.
(God, help our country...they're SOLDIERS...)


EVERY SINGLE STATION is ONLY covering that. And every bit of the tiniest information is BREAKING NEWS. And we heard from one wife at the scene whose husband called and said he's fine "but my stomach turned over and I'm 9 weeks pregnant and.."

You know lady? Your husband CALLED YOU to TELL YOU about the shootings and that he was FINE....buck up. But, she has to be interviewed in the parking lot at Ft Hood...

Do we really need that?
EVERY SINGLE DETAIL? Can't we wait for news that actually IS news?

And how the heck IS it that the world stops as far as all other news when something like this happens?

ALSO...CNN, ALL MORNING, did not show ONCE the Michael Morell hearings ...NOT ONCE> Neither did MSNBC. I'm pretty sure they're not even reporting it.

Imp said...

The POS in Congress had an opportunity to pass a bill that allowed soldiers....SOLDIERS to carry and be armed....on a military base. Soldiers returning from combat duty....who had carried live ammo, mortars and healthy magazines of .223 or 7.65 have to disarm?

If that isn't the most phucked up sheet I've ever heard in my life that's just as absurd as denying a 20 year old soldier a beer in the US...after he's killed scumbag, retrograde, POS muslims in combat?

But no...these assholes allow it to happen again. Our country is so phucked up and so directionless...I think we ought to give it back to the mexicans or indians...or...the friggin' Queen with apologies for totally screwing up a magnificent dream.

How many cowards are running this country many sissie metro sexual ADD addled POS are in charge now?

My country..tis of thee....screw this place. This "empire: Is clearly on it's last legs. Not even the common cause history books will remember what we once were.

Imp said...

Oh...I forgot...Pollard and Snowden....double tap them both.

Pollard would be should Snowden be accessible even in Russia...the POS should have an "accident".

Silverfiddle said...

IMP: Amen!

and I say that with the same sadness I imagine you felt as you were typing.