Thursday, April 28, 2011

Birth Certificate.........FINALLY! ?? UPDATE: This post is MOVED UP because there is SO much more information to discuss....please see newer comments

This is a post from yesterday but the situation's not going away and I wanted to continue the discussions, so please check out the comments section and weigh in.

Original Blog:
Who's the dope?
Since I've discussed the birth certificate here from time to time (mostly from the angle of "why keep it private if it's there and can be proven?"), I figured Obama's supposed 'closure' should be my closure, too.  But, there's a lot of action on my sitemeter for THIS article I posted a while back about why Obama would spend nearly $2 million to keep the birth certificate hidden.  Perhaps others had the same thoughts I had this morning when he sauntered out to the microphones and basically called anybody who questioned his not having provided definite proof the minute the controversy arose a dope.   So, who's the dope? 

SO, I found THIS piece, from a blog that appears otherwise fairly neutral, and from which I copy/paste below in italics:

We should note that, since Obama was elected, a number of federal cases related to the birth certificate issue — including several filed by or with the assistance of California attorney Orly Taitz, a leader among Obama birth certificate questioners — have been handled by federal attorneys, including those with the U.S. Department of Justice.
We interpret the quotations by Trump and Palin to mean payments made by Obama in a personal capacity, not in cases where he’s represented in an official capacity by government lawyers. For one thing, both Trump and Palin used the term “legal fees,” which would be irrelevant in a case defended by government lawyers.  (Z: why would anybody necessarily interpret it that way?  I believe the point is that a lot of money was spent by ANYBODY (turns out it's yours and mine now!)...isn't that enough of a curiosity?)



But, while we don’t know exactly how much the Obama camp spent on their private lawyers, there were many, many non-birth-certificate duties that a law firm typically handles in the wake of a presidential campaign, which suggests that any birth certificate work was a small percentage of the overall fees paid to Perkins Coie.   :-)   (Z; does it suggest that, really?)


This comment from that blog sums it up for me:
Doug,
Thanks for clearing that up. I feel a lot better knowing that it wasn’t Obama’s millions fighting the release of the birth certificate. It was the taxpayers money.

And so, NOW WE ARE DONE!   He was BORN HERE and it just took him two years to show us the certificate because he's been 'distracted' with government business!   AND he got every network and all the local stations cutting into normal programming for his explanation about his birth certificate ...  as he even said (so cunningly), he doesn't get that for MUCH MUCH more important issus! So WHO made this an issue? :-)


Let's hope the sun's set over this one.  I, for one, am very happy this is over.......and I hope, if it's all true, it stays over.  Maybe even the "why two years?" question will disappear.   Should it?  By the way, he sure got a good slam in this talk this morning, didn't he?   "We've got enormous challenges here!"   "I've got other things to do"   And he spoke as if every Republican only talked about this issue......quite a campaign speech again.  And all the networks and every single local station.  about a birth certificate whose authenticity could have been put to rest two years ago.  unreal.  Come to think of it, maybe we ARE the dopes.

Aloha
z

191 comments:

Sam Huntington said...

The proof of our dopiness is that Barack Hussein Obama is president.

Z said...

that is proof enough. Yes, Sam !

Opus #6 said...

Kenya believe all this fuss over one piece of paper?

Trump must have told him to release it or "there'd be hell toupee."

Jan said...

Well..maybe, we are the dopes, especially if we believe that finally presenting the long called for certificate of birth finally settles everything, once, and for all.

If it is, indeed, genuine and he has been able to gain access it at any time, why would he do anything so juvenile as to withhold something that was putting so much doubt into the minds of genuinely concerned citizens? To me, it only speaks to his own lack of character, and integrity.

Even if he did happen to be born on American soil, he still does not meet the requirements of being a 'natural born citizen' since his father was NOT an American citizen...only his mother. That being said, it still does not explain all the secrecy surrounding the rest of his documents which anyone else would have to make public.

In his press conference announcing that he was making the birth certificate public, he was so incensed, blaming all the interest in that, for distracting him from solving all of the important problems facing our country. So....why didn't he just solve the problem of the birth certificate a couple of years ago?

Sorry, but I think the timing of this is just to distract from something else....time will tell.

And yep, Sam Huntington, that he ever obtained the office in the first place really shows the depth of dopiness prevalent in this country...or proof that one of the biggest cons in history was perpetrated against us.

WomanHonorThyself said...

he was pressured Z..plain and simple..he is still a terrorist sympathizing tyrant..!

Ducky's here said...

Now, what about the millions he spent to keep it hidden? What you right wingers didn't figure out is that he spent all that money on an extremely high quality forgery.

Better keep Corsi, Breitbart and Trump on the case.

Mustang said...

I think we should next ask that Trump investigate Ducky’s origins. It is a matter of national security.

Z said...

Opus..OUCH!! :-)

Jan.....very "juvenile" indeed...unless it was a set-up. Don't forget those CNN/NETWORK producers he hired to come work in the White House, people nobody ever mentions. They're busy and they're cunning.
With Soros money, I guess you can do anything, huh?

Angel, I guess he was pressured....why'd he need the pressure?

Mustang, Ducky didn't read my post again. I keep telling him he'd sound a little brighter, but... :-)

soapster said...

1. According to SSA.gov Hawaii SS #'s start with 575-576. CT starts with 042. Obama's starts with 042.

2. Via Acrobat pro version I have, the BC finds 1 item of "deleted or cropped" content.

3. Document from US Dept. of Health, Education, and Welfare from 1961 on Natality has not 1 mention of "African" as race.

soapster said...

No folds, creases, smudges, flaws. Instead: crispy, clear, no yellowing of paper and this is supposed to be 50 years old??

soapster said...

My take? It was a contrived plan to give credibility to Trump in a win win scenario which is either assure an Obama re-election since Trump sucks royally; or (god forbid) have Trump win and continue the bankster's crooked schemes since the Donald is owned by the very bankers who assure his pseudo wealth in the form of flowing credit.

Ducky's here said...

z, figure it out. We all know that Obama is a big scary Muslim and Palin has hinted that his birth certificate proves it.

What better way to scotch that rumor than this sophisticated forgery.

You guys are on the hook for claiming millions ere spent keeping it hidden and the forgery idea let's you withdraw with honor.

Ducky's here said...

By the way,z, soapster's little "inside baseball" scenario has a lot going for it.

We want Trump out in front. Will this feed his massive ego and keep the idiot going? I've heard worse theories.

Ducky's here said...

Dan Rather, Dan Rather, Dan Rather.

This document is clearly from a Kinko's in Waco.

soapster said...

@Ducky, any good Constitutionalist knows that it wouldn't make a damn bit of difference if Obama were/is Muslim (or Romney cuz of Mormonism) since the Constitution establishes no litmus (makes no mention) on religion in Article II Section I.

Ducky's here said...

Of course that's a matter of law, soapster but the fringe right religionists and rabies radio hucksters love to harp on that one and keep the proles agitated.

1.21roots said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
sue said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Always On Watch said...

Jan said:

why would he do anything so juvenile as to withhold something that was putting so much doubt into the minds of genuinely concerned citizens? To me, it only speaks to his own lack of character, and integrity.

Why, indeed?

To smirk the way he did in today's news conference! The man's arrogance is so disgusting.

bd said...

Obama never spent $2M on hiding his birth certificate. Stop lying.

Ducky's here said...

That's right, AOW. Some fringe types like Breitbart, Corsi, Beck, Palin, Taitz and whomever make some ridiculous accusation and everything should be run to satisfy those jerks.

Please, let us know when you have something substantial like proof that he is well on his way to implementing sharia in America.

beamish said...

I'm not fooled. Adobe Acrobat wasn't even around in 1961.

;)

deaconbleu said...

Amazing how those who question the citizenship of an African American president can actually call HIM 'arrogant.'

Obama took Trump and the rest of the loony right, to the woodshed today. Good for him!

soapster said...

Looney right sums it up. Given the state of the economy, war fronts, and a myriad others, it's embarassing that any attention is given to the birth certificate, how he throws a baseball, his wife's wardroab, how much he vacations and plays golf, his NCAA picks, his use of a teleprompter, his perpetual bowing....have I missed anything?

If you can't defeat this guy on policy alone then shit....just kill me now.

Mustang said...

Mr. Obama could have resolved this entire issue in January 2009, except for his arrogance. Recall that people from the left demanded McCain prove his entitlement to serve as president, given he was born in Panama. When the right applied that same standard to the left, they had a collective seizure.

Mr. Obama remains in the tank arising from legitimate concerns involving the economy and the morass in the Middle East. Meanwhile, Donald Trump remains a buffoon.

Major said...

"I think we should next ask that Trump investigate Ducky’s origins. It is a matter of national security."

Agreed...he's to this blog as the Stuxnet is to the Iranians.

Ms. Z needs to install a MalAware program to her blog.

beamish said...

If you can't defeat this guy on policy alone then shit....just kill me now.

Banner day. I don't often agree with Soapster, but there it is.

Major said...

I downloaded that PDF file and took a good look at it too.

I was as surprised as anyone here that he "capitulated" to the pressure and in a way relieved that he did so. Albeit way too late.

However....I was interested in a couple things on this "COLB" too.

No one here has mentioned it either. His father's race is listed as.."African". Now we all should know that african is NOT a race.

First of all...it's a continent! Second there are only three legitimate recognizable races for human beings.

That being: Mongoloid, Caucasian and Negroid / Negro. Period.

Mexican, Spanish, Italian, French or even "European" ( to counter the African insertion ) are not races. Period.

Now, in 1961...and I've examined like many of us have...similiar COLB's / long form issued in the same year of O's birth and a few days before and after his date of birth. One was of a Negro father and mother. That's how prior to PC race was listed.

For example...the great actress Charlize Theron....is an "African" too. However we all know that she is Caucasian.

Africa makes up many nationalities. Liberian, Ghana, Somali, Rhodesian and South Africa and so forth.

None of them would be listed as "Africans".

Just my 2 cents worth. It just makes me suspect of the release. And that his father was not a citizen of the US but of Kenya, which was a colony of Great Britain.

I want to hear some rebuttals. Please

soapster said...

@major, I mentioned the African thing.

Jan said...

deaconbleu...it isn't so much the questioning of his citizenship, but rather the fact that he went to such lengths to conceal any evidence at all pertaining to his other documents, which would have, at least, given us a little bit of insight into the kind of person he is. It could have been such a simple process, and could have prevented so much turmoil, and suspicion. It isn't as if he happened to be someone that, at least, had been known for something other than, mostly, that of being a Community Organizer.

As for the 'African-American President' bit.....I, personally, feel offended when I am accused, directly, or otherwise, of questioning any single thing that he does, or says, or implies, is because he is African-American. That is nothing but rubbish, and a very weak argument. He is as much white, as he is black....and I wouldn't care if he happened to be purple, with yellow polka dots if he would do all that is required of him as leader of our country.

And, when I say 'leader of our country,' I mean the leader of ALL citizens, with the best interest of us all, and not just select groups. Not once, during his entire presidency, so far, have I felt that he has been.

As for that promise of "TRANSPARENCY" that was repeated, time, and time again, all I can say about that is that his actions have been about as transparent as muddy water.

You call us arrogant..well, take a good look at your hero.

Oh, and by-the-way....I don't feel that I've been 'taken to the woodshed' and I doubt that many others with an ounce of good sense feel that way, either.

He should not be given a free pass on everything, just because he is 'African-American.' He should have had to measure up, legitimately, just as every other candidate was required to do.

Just plain old "American" is fine with me.

Major..I agree.

Z said...

Ducky, I'd delete ALL of your comments, but it's important people see your thinking. I address more to you below now that I actually read all of your rubbish.

Deaconbleu....if we're all racists, how the heck do you explain that I think every Conservative who visits here, and I, would vote for Alan West in a heartbeat? Sorry, but the victimhood silliness doesn't fly here. But thanks for coming by.
I HATE every single thing Obama's said and done...actually, I think there was ONE THING I approved of and I blogged on that....can't remember what...
to infer that has anything to do with his color is racist. I'm certainly not.

Soapster, no offense, but your conspiracy theory about Trump and Obama is weirder than 9/11 nuts. WOW!

"If you can't defeat this guy on policy alone then shit....just kill me now."

As Beamish said.."AMEN TO THAT"


For those of you who don't think Obama spent big money, his or ours, on keeping the certf. tied up, PLEASE read my posts...it really helps before commenting. And look at the links. thanks.

DUCKY "That's right, AOW. Some fringe types like Breitbart, Corsi, Beck, Palin, Taitz and whomever make some ridiculous accusation and everything should be run to satisfy those jerks.

Please, let us know when you have something substantial like proof that he is well on his way to implementing sharia in America."

This MIGHT be the dumbest comment you've ever posted...
HE might not be implementing sharia in America, but you might want to treat yourself to lawyers and what they're saying about how muslims are using our laws to implement Sharia. Good that you might learn something on that and please stop being SO naive.

Z said...

by the way, did you all hear about the pastor at the church the Obamas attended on Easter Sunday?
Don't their people vet pastors? You'd think they'd be very careful after the Jeremiah Wright scandal.
This guy is as bad...
maybe the Obama people know the msm won't talk about it (which they haven't) so they're safe.
Then Conservatives say "Hey, he agrees with Jeremiah Wright....this is our PRESIDENT who finds that good?" and then we're the bad guys?
I think this 'setup' stuff is amazing....
they didn't hire bigwig network/cable producers when Obama got into the WH for nothing, did they. Very cunning...good control of publicity.
And so dangerous to a democracy.

soapster said...

Regarding my "conspiracy" theory:

Did he not put to rest the BC issue and make Trump look like a fool? (U can surely argue the validity of the doc but on the surface he put it to rest) thus helping his re-election efforts on that note? There's a very good reason Obama has spent thousands of dollars in litigation costs on this matter and then finally comes out with this today. Mind u I didn't even touch on the timing w/ respect to helicopter Ben.

AND, Trump is not a wealthy man who understands money. Men who understand wealth don't declare bankruptcy 3 times over. He's all credit and indebted to banksters.

Ducky's here said...

Anyone else going to the wedding Friday?

soapster said...

More apparent probz w/ the birth cert for those interested.

http://sherriequestioningall.blogspot.com/2011/04/here-is-problem-with-obamas-birth.html

soapster said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Ducky's here said...

Tough to let go isn't it Major.

As some of us have sussed out, the question here is whether it encourages Trump to stay in the limelight and continue to make Republicans look like fools.

44644bc4-37d3-11e0-8503-000f20980440 said...

Yeah, well Soapster, let it go, eh?

Jan, he concealed nothing, he submitted his Certificate of Birth, he was allowed to be a Presidential Candidate. He's a little busy to have to deal with all the dummies nipping at his heels like so many mangy dogs.

Ducky's here said...

BUT there is(sic) 2 GLARING PROBLEMS with the Birth certificate.

------------

Yup, that's a right wing blog page alright.

beamish said...

I admit I'm a little curious how Barack Obama's father hails from a country that didn't exist in 1961 and Barack Obama was born in a hospital that didn't bear that name until 1978.

The obvious conclusion stares us in the face.

Barack Obama isn't old enough to be President.

:P

Layla Elizabeth Gonzalez said...

What a moron. Does he truly believe we Americans are so stupid? Yes, guess he does...enough voted for the idiot! I am so livid over this!

beamish said...

Yup, that's a right wing blog page alright (sic)

Pedantic grammar lessons lose their impact when delivered with a dangling participle that isn't even a real word.

Ducky's here said...

Sorry, grammar girl, it's an acceptable variation.

Pitch till you win.

Major said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Major said...

"Barack Obama isn't old enough to be President."


Whatever Beamer...thanks...the whole COLB is bullshit.

There's too many holes left unanswered.

Z said...

Most of you have very interesting input.
Yes, there is no settling this situation, I guess...

The very idea that he let this drag so long before just COMING OUT WITH IT is ridiculous.
He's president, he could do anything he wants to do.

But...he got to use it to smack down smart people with good questions again and the msm covers for him again.

who cares? we're stuck with him no matter what.
This is a guy who goes to yet another pastor on Easter Sunday who's a Jeremiah Wright clone....don't they VET people before he does things like this?
And, again, the msm said nothing.
And then WE're the whacks? :-)

Bloviating Zeppelin said...

Only ONE common sense question:

WHY wasn't this addressed, literally, three YEARS ago?

You can make your own conclusions.

BZ

Z said...

According to an article on the b.c. situation, Hawaii's "State law prohibits the release of birth records except to those with a "tangible interest," such as the person named."
So, Obama had to write a letter and request the records.

I'd have thought doubts about where he was born casting shadows on his presidential eligibility just MIGHT have constituted "tangible interest" two years ago, but maybe it's just me?

beamish said...

Pitch till (sic) you win.

Literacy is your friend, Ducky.

Z said...

I'm wondering why those who find this a silly issue to even be discussing don't ask themselves why Obama wouldn't have put this at rest 2 years ago?

beamish said...

Whatever Beamer...thanks...the whole COLB is bullshit.

Actually, no it isn't. It's an official document of the State of Hawaii recording Obama's birth in an American hospital. Even the certificate index number is in the range of other Hawaiian long form birth certificates presented by "birthers" who were born in Hawaii at the same hospital on the the same day or next day. [Notably the Nordyke twins...] Until someone comes forward and says "That can't be Obama's birth certificate because that particular index number is assigned to MY birth certificate," I'm inclined to believe this is a legitimate scan of the real thing.

Obama was born in Honolulu, Hawaii. He's as American as you, me, and Bobby Jindal.

Obama finally gives disgruntled liberal Hillary Democrats (the 70% of the Tea Party movement that doesn't want Medicare touched by budget cuts) something they've wanted - and they're still not happy.

Obama is to be commended for raising the standards for the upcoming GOP primaries.

Let Ron Paul and Donald Trump go form a third party and corner the "moon landings were faked with tech harvested from the Roswell UFO crash" margin vote.

There's too many holes left unanswered.

Don't fall in them.

Z said...

What we're seeing here is this colb/bc validity all depends on how you want it to turn out....good arguments on both sides.

fascinating....

beamish said...

I'm wondering why those who find this a silly issue to even be discussing don't ask themselves why Obama wouldn't have put this at rest 2 years ago?

It's more fun to cut off a limb when your opponent climbs out on it.

At least, that's the simple answer.

He didn't have to release it. Ever. He simply waited until the moment to release it would be critical mass. What's Trump going to run on now? "I made the fringe look stupid?"

The only question with any sort of merit to it is whether or not Obama's US citizenship status changed when he became an Indonesian. But even that merit is flimsy.

Obama feigns that he wants to change the topic to policy - economic and foreign. That's precisely a place he feels safe pretending to be as long as Reagan conservatives are still trying to hold alliance with people who don't belong in the Republican Party in the first place.

Let the purge begin.

Ducky's here said...

Pitch till you win, never heard the carnival expression, Beamish?

Now, I know that someone who thinks a string quartet performs under a baton is very sheltered but you seem positively deprived.

Ducky's here said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
Elmers Brother said...

But I notice that the Taliban dug a four hundred foot tunnel under a maximum security prison and enptied the joint while you military intellectual giants were on duty

Wait duhkkkster, when Abu Ghraib happened you and the media believed the fault went all the way to the top and NOW you just want to pin it on some schlub E-nothing. Stick it where the sun don't shine, hypocrite.

beamish said...

Pitch till you win, never heard the carnival expression, Beamish?

I'm wondering how one pitches a "till." Did you mean "until" slang shortened with an apostrophe - 'til?

I already knew I won when you left your modifiers dangling. ;)

Now, I know that someone who thinks a string quartet performs under a baton is very sheltered but you seem positively deprived. (sic)

As opposed to "negatively enthroned?"

Is English your second language, Ducky?

You are as apparently ill-equipped for criticism of grammar as you are for analysis of economics, art, music, or any other subject you find yourself punch-drunk in trying to keep up with.

Let me guess, you actually paid someone money for your "education."

beamish said...

I notice that the Taliban dug a four hundred foot tunnel under a maximum security prison and enptied the joint while you military intellectual giants were on duty.

Would that be the military intellectual giants on duty guarding the Sarposa jail in Khandahar - Afghan police and security forces, or the US and NATO military intellectual giants who've been arguing against the turning over of security to the Karzai government before it is ready with forces trained to meet that challenge ever since Obama came up with his "outta there by Ramadan" strategy for withdrawal this summer?

Or was that quip of yours just another one of your egregious examples of leftist argument via lack of reading comprehension, Ducky?

Z said...

Ducky, I didn't build this blog for that, so I deleted (Or "CENSORED" as you so enjoy saying!!) :-)
as for 'ad hominems'...every comment you make is an ad hominem attack. Now you're whining about Major?
By the way, you also mention 'right wing' as if it's an attack. It isn't, we're proud of it. COuldn't be prouder.

Always On Watch said...

See Layla's recent post on this topic and my comments thereto.

Z said...

thanks, AOW...that 'm' and "African" thing is curious to a lot of us...

Z said...

AOW..by the way, did you see the video below? Watch till the end :-)

soapster said...

Bear in mind this is a government which has lied countless times to bring us into war, has made fake bin Laden videos (not conspiracy this is all documented on record), used its own military as guinea pigs, etc.

Faking a birth certificate is nothing to them.

As I said, I've never used this issue as a means to discredit Obama and his failing policies. However, it is worth questioning inconsistencies when they arise.

What's more, an entity cannot by definition objectively investigate itself. Let us suppose for a minute that the government were complicit in JFK assassination or 9/11 (hypothetical here so relax on the commentary). So then what?...they set up a government commission to investigate. What might we presume they come up with? Uh...no fault here...move along.

It's absurd. Obama and the WH are not to be the final arbiter on whether this BC is legit because naturally they will of course conclude it is even if it is not.

Always On Watch said...

Z,
The Taliban video?

Z said...

soapster, of course "It's absurd. Obama and the WH are not to be the final arbiter on whether this BC is legit because naturally they will of course conclude it is even if it is not."

Let them answer the AFRICAN and "small m" question, too.
Check out CNN on this subject...they're adoring this chance to smack the Right around because we had the intelligence and curiosity to get to the truth. THey won't check into it because they're practically in the Administration.......
So FOX says anything more with valid oddities worth a few answers from Obama, and WE are the dopes, as I wrote in my post.
typical. Sheer Alinsky

Z said...

Yes, AOW...I thought it was good....better at the end!

soapster said...

I don't fault Alinsky. He was on to something and to be honest, our merry band of liberty activists here in the twin cities of Minnesota have found some of his teachings to be quite beneficial to our cause.

Know thy enemy. ;-)

Z said...

too bad...those are mind bending, nasty ways to get your bidding done.

soapster said...

Sorta like those activists that exposed ACORN huh?

Ticker said...

Where is the seal that is suppose to appear on all BC. There is no seal of authentication statement that claims it is a valid document, but there should be and must be before it is acceptable. Try taking the POS that is suppose to be Odummers BC to Drivers Services in Georgia or in Texas and see how far you get in obtaining a driver license with it.
And yes, I also noted the "race" item. That within itself makes it a fraud. Somebody went to a lot of trouble only to screw up by listing African as a race. They must be as dumb as Duckbutt.

Z said...

soapster,
Ya, some of Alinsky worked at Acorn...and NPR...no doubt about it.
you have a point.
what a sad country whose people have to resort to that...on either side.

Ticker, I just can't imagine Obama couldn't swing a seal or know what had to be done if this isn't real.
That 'm' is a little suspect, I have to admit...did you see that?
"AFRICAN" is quite odd, too....but...

Joe said...

In 1961 it would have been outrageous to use the term "African" in an official document.

In 2011 it would be outrageous to use the word "Negroid" or "Negro" in an official document.

When do we think this document was created?

And what do we do about this and a dozen others like it:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wQAqvtXenKg

Mark said...

"And so, NOW WE ARE DONE! He was BORN HERE"

Uh...not so fast, my friend.

Look closely at that "Birth Certificate".

It looks fake, and there are already numerous challenges to it's validity.

Z said...

I know, Joe and Mark...am hearing discrepancies and very weird things coming up today.
But, of course, we're not to ask, and we're to just trust Obama on faith! :-)

It's been a GREAT tool in branding Conservatives like he likes us branded, hasn't it? It worked in his favor that way...and has worked against America so badly.

no seal, small capital 'm' , very weird..and African.

But, wouldn't you THINK the Obama thugs would have made sure it looked absolutely authentic? It's brand spanking crisp new, from what I hear, too! HOW? Even sitting in files, things get dry or old. After Dan Rather's lies, you'd think the left would have learned.

By the way, have all of you YOUR birth certificates in your personal files at home?

Z said...

A friend just emailed me this :

"I have a friend who is a studious sort of guy and he has plenty of time on his hands. So, he took a close look at this document. While I would have thought that this issue would have been closed for good (and, got the crazies to crawl back into their holes, especial The Donald), he found two extremely strange inconsistencies that merit some attention and an explanation by our illustrious president.

First of all, the birth certificate that the White House released lists Obama's birth as August 4, 1961. It also lists Barack Hussein Obama as his father. At the time of Obama's birth, it also shows that his father is aged 25 years old, and that Obama's father was born in "Kenya, East Africa". This wouldn't seem like anything of concern, except the fact that Kenya did not even exist until 1963, two whole years after Obama's birth, and 27 years after his father's birth. How could have Obama's father have been born in a country that did not yet exist? Up and until Kenya was formed in 1963, it was known as the "British East Africa Protectorate". But, this is not the only thing that my friend discovered that was not consistent.

The other item that my friend looked into was the hospital that Obama was born in. On the birth certificate released by the White House, the listed place of birth is "Kapi'olani Maternity & Gynecological Hospital". This cannot be, because the hospital(s) in question in 1961 were called "KauiKeolani Children's Hospital" and "Kapi'olani Maternity Home", respectively. The name did not change to Kapi'olani Maternity & Gynecological Hospital until 1978, when these two hospitals merged. How can this particular name of the hospital be on a birth certificate dated 1961 if this name had not yet been applied to it until 1978??????????

Go ahead, look it up, these are the facts. Now that it has been released, it appears to me that Obama has dug himself even deeper and is open to more explanation. If there is some doubt, just look at the following resources:

Sure as hell, the hospital part is true, as you can read about the 1978 merger here. Could it be possible with all the idiots surrounding Obama that in their infinite wisdom to phony up a document they did not do their research and missed these two very germane points???????"


Will any media follow up on ANY of this:? And do we have a government this sloppy (assuming these problems ARE problems) and are they running US like this, too?

soapster said...

They didn't put this fake ass document out there because they thought people would buy it. They put it out intentially of course. For what purpose??

Oh I dunno...maybe to avoid discussing war, inflation, bailouts and the like?

cube said...

I'm hearing the chatter of "Move along. Nothing here to see," from the media outlets.

We're supposed to trust the least vetted and most secretive president in the history of this country.

Opus#6: Very punny :-)

Z said...

Soapster, maybe to take away from the horrific appointments/elevations of Petraeus and Panetta?
THAT's a story sorely needing the light of day and it's in the dark.
David "Holy Koran" Petraeus is now appointed to head the CIA?
Leon "did a bad job with my last position" Panetta for DEFENSE?

The only relief is getting rid of Gates, who started off good and went on some wild-a'd ride when he went to work for Obama. What the heck happened to HIM?

Z said...

http://www.infowars.com/new-obama-birth-certificate-is-a-forgery/

there's more.

Z said...

cube, you're lucky that's all you've heard...have you seen CNN lately? It's as if there is absolutely no reason for anybody to have ever questioned Obama's birth place and now they're treating this new sheet like gospel....as if everything looks absolutely authentic.

Yawn, I wish it had; Some things come to mind:

We have someone lying again

We have someone running our country who can't fake better than this

We have people who should have learned from Dan Rather and been far more careful...meaning we have people in control who haven't learned from history.

Yikes. What a disastrous recipe

Scotty said...

In 2011 it would be outrageous to use the word "Negroid" or "Negro" in an official document.

Just speculation on my part but, this could just be part and parcel of “pigeon english”. One of the major dialects of the Hawaiian Islands.

My mother was born and raised on the islands and I have a LOT of family there. My step grandmother, who is 102, calls blacks, Africans to this day. It could just be a snafu because of the dialect there.

I visited my grandparents many times during the 60’s. Things tended to simpler then especially for the islanders. One was either from the Islands or they were from the mainland, or a European or an African, etc.

Most of us here are old enough to remember when the politically correct thing to call a black person was, an African American.

While many may see many discrepancies in the birth certificate the African usage might be a non-issue.

It reminds me of a time when my grandparents came to vist us in upstate NY. We showed Nettie, my grandmother, the beaches of Lake Ontario.....she wanted to know which ocean is was....

Leticia said...

I don't trust Obama and I believe
there is something amiss as to why after all this time he finally released a copy of his birth certificate.

I don't believe it is authentic and I also am convinced he spent all that money to forge one.

But, that's just my opinion.

Z said...

Scotty, you might be right but I'd have thought each State has to comply with national guidelines and soapster commented with this:

3. Document from US Dept. of Health, Education, and Welfare from 1961 on Natality has not 1 mention of "African" as race.


See, it just doesn't make sense.
Funny, because in this country in the '60's was when BLACK instead of NEGRO came into usage "I'm Black and PROUD" remember the songs and the protests? It was later that AFRICAN American first came into usage......probably 10 yrs after Barack was born, I'd have thought.

Leticia, imagine this much time and money spent covering up a b.c. and then supplying one which STILL looks bad?

Is soapster right and this is a cover for ....taking our minds off the economy (as if we could), their hiring more czars at midnight on a Friday night...the HORRID and ill-advised placements of Petraeus and Panetta..?? Who knows?

Bd said...
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Z said...

bd, our houses will be taken from us because of liberals....I'll leave 'morons' out because we don't speak like that here at geeez.
Run our economy into the dirt, borrow so much we'll never recover from China (there is NO way we can at this point), promise entitlements to the minorities and our indoctrinated poor college kids and you'll win every time...and kill America in the process. I forgot to mention all my lib doctors (I was in the med business and know a LOT of them) who're angry at Republicans for not stopping OBAMA CARE...now that they're being threatened and now that they can't take insurance or medicare...and now that their rich clients are going to HMO's because they're seeing that the BLUES will necessarily have to close down.. remember Obama's "YOU CAN KEEP YOUR OWN INSURANCE" ?
That's almost the biggest lie of his administration...ALMOST.

back to house, Bush tried for how many years to warn about the ridiculous notion that EVERYBODY SHOULD HAVE A HOUSE AND WE'LL HELP YOU...remember?
Remember the video of Daniel Mudd promising the BNC (with Obama as a new senator in attendance) that Freddie and Fannie Maes will do everything to get everyone in houses...mp dpwnpayment? NO WORRIES (what were they THINKING?)
Guess who's lost their homes: the poor the stupid libs tried to help. WHEN will you people learn?

If you'd read anything but kos and moveon and if you'd watch anything but msnbc and CNN, you'd learn that approx $1.7 million was spent on lawyer bills by Obama and now they're admitting that but saying other things were covered and that the FEDERAL GOV'T PICKS UP A LOT OF HIS LEGAL FEES BUT THEY CAN'T DIVULGE WHERE IT GOES...IMAGINE?. It's IN my link, why not educate yourself?

Here's another liberal who just can't force himself to realize who's really screwing this country (come by for the stats tomorrow, by the way) and who didn't notice that his hero waited almost 3 years before presenting something we all have in our files at home. odd.

thanks for coming by..

Z said...
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sue said...
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Z said...

Sue, I honestly don't remember that. And yes, he is a buddy...

If he did, he should apologize and I should have deleted it.
I hope you let it go, I'm running the best blog I know how.

Bd said...
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Bd said...
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Z said...

read my post and the links, maybe you'll learn something.

please start supplying FOX lies, okay? I watch EVERYTHING and read everything; you types just can't fathom someone well read and informed who doesn't agree with you. tsk tsk.

By the way, I do watch FOX because it's the only station that has all sides; I watch msnbc for humor and CNN when Shep Smith is on FOX, who I can't stand.

By the way..talk about Trump: He mentions Obama and basketball and libs are now labeling him RACIST? :-) That's YOU GUYS, bd. unbelievable.

And, by the way....I was wrong, you do seem to be a moron.
Again, thanks for coming by.

"take all night", bd....go for it. But, only after you've done some research; don't depend on msnbc. THanks.

Z said...

"It is a lie." REALLY?

Sort of like when Obama said he barely new Bill Ayres, bd?
or when he said he'd never heard Jeremiah Wright damn America or even come close (then he goes to church on Easter, to a pastor who's a Wright clone?)
Same sort of lie like Valerie Jarrett saying "we've followed Van Jones for years and like what we see" then saying, when they find out the rest of the country found out he's a Communist, that they didn't know he was quite so radical and let him go (except they snuck him into a new job)?
need i go on?

Scotty said...

Scotty, you might be right but I'd have thought each State has to comply with national guidelines and soapster commented with this:

Not necessarily, Z, I've got my original birth certificate my parents were given when I was born. It's got less information than the one the president in showing now and most of the information on mine was hand written. I was born in NY state.


At first glance one would think it's a baptismal certificate, it that helps you visualize what it looks like.

I would almost guarantee that it wouldn't be accepted by most organizations as an "official" one.

Ducky's here said...

@z I watch EVERYTHING and read everything;

=================

What did you think of today's "Democracy Now"?

My guess is you don't subscribe to Uprising, Best of the Left, Counterspin and the like, which is surprising since you read everything although my guess is your subscription to "The Nation" has been dormant for some time.

Z said...

Ducky, I don't read those, no.. ..absolutely not. I read the NY Times, I read the Post, I sometimes read the Globe...and yes, if I see a NATION article on line, I'll scan it..
I watch CNN and MSNBC...I like to see what most Americans are seeing, but, of course, that leads me back to FOX.

By the way...I was wondering when you'd like your tax dollars to go to funding Hannity? Mine have to fund Moyers on pbs...just wondering.

Gee, when I said "EVERYTHING" I figured you realized nobody CAN read everything, but there you go! :-)

Ducky's here said...
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Z said...

you missed it, but thanks for the silly sanctimonious lecture again, Ducky.

I'm laughing here hearing libs say TRUMP IS A RACIST because he mentioned basketball in connection with Obama's name. Honestly, are they SERIOUSLY that scared he could win their idol's job away from him?

Impertinent said...

"I admit I'm a little curious how Barack Obama's father hails from a country that didn't exist in 1961 and Barack Obama was born in a hospital that didn't bear that name until 1978."


Beamer....Unless of course you equate this with his complete and utter incompetency to be the CIC as we expect.

He's a fraud....a huckster.....a manipulator and a complete incompetent.

As far as his COLB...he probably hired some Chicago ole "Dons" to come up with the recent scam too.

The fact that the morons who produced this fake....didn't know that "African" is not a race.

sue said...
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Bd said...
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Major said...
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Z said...
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Major said...
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Major said...

Ms. Z.....I'm gone.

I cannot stand by while these people diss you.

I cannot stand by while these scum disparage you.

My hate....is earned. My hate has been qualified,

I will never post here again.

It's obvious that I have way too much animosity ....to be accepted here. But....as a goddamn Marine...I gave what I had.

Z said...

Major, don't leave.
I just deleted all the crazy stuff; this is a wonderful place for people to read and comment and if any liberal thinks that an avowedly Conservative blog is going to stop being Conservative and giving the information we know they're absolutely wrong.

Thanks for your support: I must admit it's astonishing for liberals to come to a Conservative blog then whine at its conservatism and slam the blog hostess, but there we are.

Remember, the libs need perfection or we wouldn't have laws lowering coffee temps every time one in a million people spills coffee on themselves...just for one example.
And there is no perfection.....
in a blog or anywhere else.

To the liberals, I hope you'll be happy reading liberal blogs or somebody else's conservative one because I'm not taking the insults to me or my readers anymore.

Good luck!

sue said...

Z - So it's worse than I thought. You are now avoiding the truth by deleting comments that in your heart you know are right.

Before you are deleting, you surely are reading my comments.

I'm sorry you are choosing a life of
negativism over one that could be constructive.

(Where do these people come from anyway?)

Major said...

"Major, don't leave."


Ms. Z...you're a totally wonderful person and a gift as far as I'm concerned.

I was in Mosul in '05...I was in too many places to even give a nano of respect to Iraqis ...or to any muslim.

My time there found that...no matter what...NOW MATTER we did for them resulted in more resentment and hate for Americans than before we "rescued" them.

Muslims....hate America.

And I hate muslims.

Jan said...

Major..it's not my blog, but I, too, beg you not to leave...I, for one, would miss you, very much.

I know it's hard to read some of the vitriol spewed from certain ones, but my sweet Mama used to tell me to 'just consider the source.'

I understand how you feel, and I know how hard it must be for you, at times, so please reconsider, and stay

sue said...

Z - The one thing that you said about Obama that wasn't negative was that he shook hands with every West Point Cadet upon graduation.

I remember because I was amazed that you said something about him that wasn't negative. Sue

Major said...

Last Comment....

Pay attention sue, ducky and the other assholes of liberalism....


"Demorats"...the party of secessionism , the party of slavery, the party of slovenislm, now the party of socialism, the party of Jim Crow, the party of Robert Byrd, the party of the Gores....the party of the KKK, the party of division...the party of racism...the party pf unions...the party of separatism....The party of...anarchy and chaos.

I ...will fight you with my last dying breath.

You...are the death of America,,,,you are scum.

I'm gone....done....and thanks Ms. Z.

Z said...

Sue, that's fine. believe what you need to...and good luck to you.

Z said...
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Z said...

Major, please see Jan's remark to you and please don't go.
WHY would you leave? Ignore the nastiness and please, please stay. I DO :-)
I won't have anybody drive you from my blog and, if you go, you let it happen! Stay, please.

Jan, thanks so much....Major and I got off to a kind of rough start and, from then on, he has been respectful of me, kind and informative and offers a viewpoint of a soldier who gave a leg for our freedom. He rates very high in my book.

sue said...

I'd like to stay around for more of this but it's two hours later here.

Funny how times change - The whole world is waiting to watch a couple be married in a few hours and they've already been living together.

Go figure.

Goodnight, Z

Major said...

"Major and I got off to a kind of rough start and, from then on, he has been respectful of me, kind and informative and offers a viewpoint of a soldier who gave a leg for our freedom. He rates very high in my book."


There have not been too many times when I have had tears in my eyes. As I do now. I'm trying to stay focused and stay, unemotional.

I can't. It's just too hard for me...way too hard at times to sit still...to be "correct" and quiet or "civilized". I'm not very good at texting my true feelings...I swear...I really swear...that I'm humbled and gratified that anyone would want to suffer my indignities, or my opinions ....hell my vulgarities...my passion is well....sometimes....too out there, I suppose.

I am...I admit....a vulgar person. Way too unpolished for this forum. We Marines...do not mince words!
Please...Please forgive me for my passion.

I took an oath....my fellow Marines, took an oath. And that is..to protect and defend...Period.

Yea....I gave my country what I was asked to do. And it wasn't all that much.

Defend her. Honor her. Stand by her and always love her.

I am a consummate..fool.

No one else cares about us anymore...like A Marine matters...to another person Like Ms.Z

All I want...is for America to be free. To be brave...to be resolute...to be firm....just as I was asked when I became a Marine.

I Love you all...all American patriots and supporters of freedom.

Please...corny as it is.....GOD BLESS AMERICA.

Major

Z said...

Major, you rate with all of us conservatives.
You are definitely no fool...no way.
Just glad you're here.
thanks for sticking around...you are NOT a loser and I knew you wouldn't let others shoo you away.
I'm glad.

Major said...

"I understand how you feel, and I know how hard it must be for you, at times, so please reconsider, and stay"

Jan....I see two or three heros here...and you are one of them.

Thank you....God Bless you. It's hard for me as it is for Ms. Z too.

I'll try to be ...less...errr.....bombastic?

Major

Major said...

"Major, you rate with all of us conservatives. "


Ms.Z...I will tell you that there is no other place on earth...like this place.

The freeedom...the ability to express any opinion...is ...well a Goddamn miracle. Hell..I don't know one damn thing about you!!!

However.....you are the closest thing to my commandant and my oath that I've ever witnessed.

You are...a miracle. A Patriot.

An anomaly.

My Marine ( American ) oath says that I might say...GOD BLESS...AMERICA.

Jan said...

Oh, Major..I'm certainly no hero, but thank you so much for your kind words.

I know that Z agrees with me, that you are an asset to her blog, and I enjoy reading your comments...thank you for being a better, and more genuine person than anyone who would drive you away.

You are who you are, Major...and that's good enough for me!

Pris said...

I'd like to chime in.
Major, we regulars, conservatives here, love our Marines and all our troops. We appreciate your sacrifices and dedication to America.

I too, ask you to stay. I know sometimes, some things which are said, are hard to take, but when push comes to shove, we love coming here, and we love Z.

You are a true American and we need all like you we can get.

How you feel is understandable. If anyone has the right to feel as you do, it's you. You've earned it, and fought for it.

For my part I thank you for standing up for my friend Z. She is the best, isn't she.

So, Major, stay, we want you here.

Z said...

Pris, thanks so much. I'm glad you agree about hoping Major stays and you're very kind to us both...thanks.

Jan, I must tell Major that you emailed me privately and he can rest assured you mean what you say to him here, that you'd miss his presence here, that you are fond of him as I am.

Major, you, Sir, are the Patriot...but thank you for your amazing remarks to me.

We need to FIGHT, we need to be respectful of others, and we need to keep up our conservatism and stand up for America.

Always On Watch said...

From this WaPo editorial:

...The “birther” delusion would be laughable if it were not so widespread and if it did not carry with it the unmistakable whiff of racism.

Damn, I'm sick of this nonsense that any opposition -- or perceived opposition -- to Obama is racist in origin and motivation.

Following that kind of logic, all blacks who opposed any white President were racists as they must have opposed him because of his race.

Is anyone else here as sick of the race card as I am?

Mark said...

Sue, and Bd:

This is Z's blog. She makes the rules. She can bend or break her own rules if she so chooses.

You canno t bend or break her rules unless she allows you. You do not have that authority. She is a benevolent dictator in that regard.

If you don't like the opinions expressed on her blog, you have a simple choice:

DON'T READ IT!

It's as simple as that.

beamish said...

OMGWTF?

People are reaching here.

Yes, Kenya wasn't named as a republic until 1963, but as a Brtish Protectorate and colony it was called "Colony of Kenya, Brtish East Africa" or "Kenya, East Africa."

No discrepancy there.

Also, the name of the hospital is not suspect, as other birth certificates presented by "birthers" from Hawaii on the same day or around the same date [notably the Nordyke twins, if you follow birtherism] in the same hospital also have the same name listed as the hospital.

The birth certificate is legitimate. Get over it already.

Always On Watch said...

Beamish,
Studying the birth certificate is interesting. It's a diversion as its authenticity doesn't matter. BHO will continue on as he is doing.

In my view, he could do or say anything and still be "The One" because the Cult of Obama has blinded so many. This blindness came home to me the other evening when my cousin and I had a brief political discussion. Like so many Americans educated in the liberal public school system of Northern Virginia, she is blaming the rich for America's economic woes. No facts I cited impacted her at all. Ugh.

44644bc4-37d3-11e0-8503-000f20980440 said...

Aw, poor little righies hate other points of view..and the truth...has to censors like the fascists they are:

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Z said...

beamish, actually, there are people studying who don't agree with you!

As for the other commenter: :-)
they were liberal insults and such nastiness I'm sorry you didn't read them.
Know the truth first, then comment, okay? Thanks!

Z said...

AOW,
Yes, won't it be wonderful when the rich are picked bone dry and NOBODY has a job and everybody has to go to the government teet?
sad

Z said...

and AOW, you're right.
It's why I'm blogging the amazement of these things and nothing else.
Nobody's going to fire Obama for lies, if this is yet another stall...
As soapster said, there's enough to get him on the way he's running things..that should be quite enough...
Heck, maybe he'll borrow a bunch more money while we're busy tearing this certificate apart, too?

Jen said...

Sorry this isn't a post about the birth certificate, Z.

I just have to laugh and laugh and laugh when people cry and whine about "censorship"!

Seriously.
I just laughed.

This is not a public (government-run) blog.

This is run by an individual.

Oh man. It's just too funny.

Consider a conservative visiting a liberal blog and slinging insults. Would he not be "censored"? Sure he would. He should be. Grow up and debate like a rational human being.


And sue? Next time you gripe at Z about her being "negative", watch that your other three fingers don't poke you in the eye. (just a suggestion).

Are we so unaware of ourselves?

Bd said...

No one wants to 'pick the rich dry.' It's astounds me how average Americans who are taking the brunt of this recession can cow tow to the righty mantra of supporting tax cuts for the wealthy when it is the lowest in decades. Eliminating them would balance the budget in less than 5 years.

Hey even the wealthy are now saying they should pay more taxes!

Z said...

bd, you know, I don't really disagree with you on that...not 100% (and thanks for being civil this time for a change, by the way)
You say anything about dumb again or any of your insults and you're GONE...trust me. You're a guest here and you've taken high advantage of that, as Jen reminds...

I do think this is a dangerous time to pay too much more in taxes because these are the people who's discretionary spending keeps the country alive, in a way. See Bloomberg's more recent comments.

And, of course, the wealthy CAN give more if they want; I suggested that be added to the IRS forms only a few posts ago in a comment. WHy not?

I'm not sure you're correct that it would balance the budget in 5 years, but it would be nice to consider that could happen.
Sadly, we're in so much debt to China thanks to Obama that we'll never recover, anyway.


Jen, thanks.......I kind of laugh at that, too. Libs come HERE, an avowedly conservative blog, and slam conservatives..if only they could actually discuss anything ...
without ad hominems.......Maybe it makes them feel powerful..
ah, well.
I'm reminded of when Tony Snow died and Huffington had to close down under the barrage of HAPPY DAY comments...it was horrid. She deleted that whole blog post, of course, when Conservatives saw that. Every time Cheney's sick, it's HAPPY DAYS again from the left.
I remember when Ted Kennedy died and all of us (ALL) said they didn't agree with the guy much but RIP, Mr. Kennedy.
There's a difference in Conservatives and I'm proud to be one.

beamish said...

beamish, actually, there are people studying who don't agree with you!

There could be no correct without the multitudes of incorrect. :)

I've not seen all of the new spins from the dead-enders in the birther movement, but I think it's safe to say no honest conversation is possible with a birther as long as they cling to the absurd idea that they're not imbeciles.

Enough people born on or around Obama's birthday in 1961 in Hawaii and at the same hospital have offered up their own long form birth certificates online to see that:

1. The name of the hospital is consistent

2. The certificate index numbers are close enough in range to conclude they're in a sequential set that includes Obama's birth certificate

Calling Obama's father's birthplace "Kenya, East Africa" is as correct as one can get for the time, as that was how one would name the Colony of Kenya, British East Africa beack then before Kenyan independence.

Calling Obama's father's race "African" isn't all that controversial either. My own race is listed as "Caucasian" on my birth certificate and I don't even have any Eastern European relatives. If it were up to me, my race would be listed as "Human."

I believe it's time to come to terms with what is motivating some people doubt that Obama was born in Hawaii.

Why is it such an issue for the Tea Party rank and file, 70% of which are disgruntled Democrats for Hillary who don't want their Medicare gravy train touched?

Well, the stock answer, as always, is that leftists are incapable of rational thought.

These are the people who left the Democratic Party over the nomination of a black man.

The sooner Republicans and conservatives leave the Tea Party to Donald Trump's ranting about Geico commercials and Ron Paul's neo-Nazi 9/11 Truther base, the better.

beamish said...
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beamish said...

BTW, I'm sorry I missed the fireworks last night with all the now deleted comments.

I pulled a big chunk of overtime last night at work, came home and crashed pretty much until a few hours before having to go to work again. Did laundry while watching some guy on government welfare get married in England this morning.

beamish said...

Aw, poor little righies hate other points of view..and the truth...has to censors like the fascists they are

Calling right-wingers "fascists" is as nonsensical as calling leftists "intelligent."

Fascism, in historical terms, is anti-capitalist guild socialism. (i.e. "right-wing fascist" is an oxymoron)

Why does leftism depend so much upon illiteracy?

Z said...

beamish, here's a lefty who comes here and insults and slams and whines and WE are the ones who "hate other points of view"

:-)

Bd said...

Wow Beamish, way to make up a definition but sorry, you're totally wrong.

beamish said...

Bd,

No, I'm not.

Fascism was all about government regulation / central planning and anti-laissez faire capitalism.

Nothing right-wing about that whatsoever.

I also wasn't wrong about leftists being unintelligent.

beamish said...

the birth certificate is not fake

Z said...

The point is that anybody'd work so hard at keeping something under wraps for more than 2 years...and why.
And that people have been given so much reason to mistrust this president by this president that he's doubted like this at all.

beamish said...

The point is that anybody'd work so hard at keeping something under wraps for more than 2 years...and why.

Ever play poker? You can up the ante as high as you want when you're holding a royal flush.

Obama has achieved, with a few million dollars and a soldier thrown in jail for disobeying his deployment orders, quite a run of the table.

Donald Trump anted in to call Obama's "bluff," and Obama showed his cards to reveal he wasn't bluffing. Obama raked in all the chips - a pot worth the discrediting of the Tea Party birthers and everyone stupid enough to continue to associate with them.

And that people have been given so much reason to mistrust this president by this president that he's doubted like this at all.

Indeed. But at least those who mistrust Obama simply because he's black - the Democrats who jumped ship for the Tea Party because Hillary Clinton didn't win the nomination - are out of the game.

The game's not over for those betting against Obama on policy issues and ideology.

Z said...

Obama bluffs for almost 3 years.
Trump calls his bluff and Obama produces..something.
Who lost? :-)

beamish said...
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beamish said...

Obama wasn't bluffing, as far as his place of birth is concerned.

I say it again, as nicely as I can:

The majority of the Tea Party, the people who trade in Obama birth certificate conspiracy theories, ARE Democrats pissed that a black man beat Hillary Clinton for the Democratic Party nomination.

No one should confuse them with conservatives, and all should view their rhetoric about "taking over the GOP" with suspicion if not outright bemusement.

Obama just threw a bucket of shame on people who otherwise agree with Obama on everthing but his skin color. It is these people for whom charges of racism against the Tea Party are directed.

Whatever their anti-Obama sentiments are in terms of usefulness in a coalition to defeat Obama - politica makes strange bedfellows - they should not be confused with conservatives.

Blessed be the Republican candidate that encourages people to stay home if their only reason for voting against Obama is his skin color. Obama needs those Tea Party Democrats for Medicare back.

We never needed them at all.

Now we can have the ideological fight we should have had in 2008, a nice left vs. right fight.

Perhaps Obama can win back the Democrats that split for the Tea Party by promising to give nuclear warheads to the Palestinians if they swear to only use them on Jews.

Faith said...
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Z said...

Faith, as extremely proud of GeeeZ as I am, and grateful for amazing people commenting here peacefully and informatively all day and night, there are many better blogs than mine...perhaps some of my commenters would be happier there and I encourage it!
thanks for your input.

Faith said...

Sorry, shouldn't have removed my post, so I'm reposting it:

===========================
OK, I'll probably regret saying anything at all but I'm going to say it and get thrown under the bus for it or whatever.

If it's really true that uncivil remarks are unwelcome at this blog then Sue's being treated uncivilly by beamish ought to have been taken seriously instead of brushed aside. Not only was her complaint brushed off with a lame excuse but now it has even been deleted altogether.

Beamish's remarks in general are at least as nasty as Ducky's. I can't stand either of them. Even when beamish says something I agree with I hate the way he says it. He's rude and abusive pretty much as a matter of style, or character. His humor is not much better than abuse. Lately he's been a little better behaved but he's not to be trusted and his latest post is the usual mystifying stuff that's not worth trying to figure out. I still have questions about the birth certificate too and I'm not a Democrat.

There is no way to have a discussion about anything beamish has a strong opinion about if he disagrees with you. He calls people who consider themselves conservatives "leftists" and "Democrats." That's mystifying at least and tyrannical as well as he repeats it over and over again in abusive language so that nobody can answer him and his evil definitions stick. Since he's usually not called on it he gets away with it. I'm glad, frankly, that he finally was so nasty to Z and Pris that he did get told off, but there's no changing the leopard's spots. Funny, he's accepted as a Christian whereas I'm in doubt because I identify heretics and explain disasters as God's judgments.

I'd put up with FT's off topic wanderings before I'd put up with beamish for half a second.

But I'm one whose posts have been treated with unchallenged abuse too so I know I'm not welcome here even though I've never been officially asked to leave. I still read this blog because some of the topics are interesting and informative -- I just avoid Ducky and beamish as much as possible.

It is quite true that Z has every right to run this blog however she pleases, including refusing some uncivil remarks while ignoring others. That's her call, but it's just not true that ALL uncivil remarks are unwelcome.

So you can ignore me too.
====

By the way, I originally came here because I knew you at FPM and thought you were a friend. My mistake. Seems I'm not the only one.

Z said...

Faith, well, I did avoid being unkind back but you got the last shot. I'm surprised at you.
Beamish is difficult. I am sorry you couldn't handle him but we're all adults here.
And, also, nobody here judges who is and isn't a Christian. ever.
I sincerely wish you the best.

Z said...

I see you and your friend on my site meter...are you both watching to see what happens? Was it so important, Faith, for you to watch (You were here even more often during the nightmare he put me through) as your friend tried to ruin geez as he nearly single handedly ruined FPM? How many times did he get banished from there, and you both are surprised I couldn't take it here,either!??
I'm really surprised. And then you suggest it's I who haven't been a friend? How many emails did I get in the form of apologies? And then to be taken advantage of again?
Two of you did your best to stir the pot, I'd try to remind of what's acceptable here and what's not; I was called unbelievable names, particularly when I was sicker than I've been, and particularly after I am still grieving my amazing husband and you both do this?
I'm so sorry I haven't been your friend. And I'm sorry you have pushed me to this remark I've tried for months to avoid.
I won't be reading any comments anymore....this is good for no one.

There, now I got the last word; it's not important to me anymore as I've grown in ways I'm humbled by, but there's a limit.

FairWitness said...

Hi Z, you're a great "bus driver" and I enjoy riding on it. Anyone who doesn't enjoy the ride is free to get off the bus and walk. Or they can throw themselves under it.

I endured much of the same misery with the "friend" myself. I wish we were all kinder and more civilized, as you always are. I love this blog and Major is my favorite poster! I am a real sucker for a man in uniform!

beamish said...

Faith,

Beamish's remarks in general are at least as nasty as Ducky's.

Don't short-change me. Ducky lacks the wit to even wade in my league.

I can't stand either of them. Even when beamish says something I agree with I hate the way he says it.

Oh come on. Dictionaries aren't that hard to use.

He's rude and abusive pretty much as a matter of style, or character. His humor is not much better than abuse.

You either lack a sense of humor, or have never been abused.

Lately he's been a little better behaved but he's not to be trusted and his latest post is the usual mystifying stuff that's not worth trying to figure out. I still have questions about the birth certificate too and I'm not a Democrat.

Not even I think all stupid people are Democrats just because all Democrats are stupid.

There are no intelligent questions regarding Obama's birth certificate remaining if there ever where any in the first place.

There is no way to have a discussion about anything beamish has a strong opinion about if he disagrees with you.

Yet discussions involving people I strongly disagree with take place here and everywhere else in the world. Perhaps you need vitamins and exercise.

He calls people who consider themselves conservatives "leftists" and "Democrats."

And people call moderate Republicans "RINOs." I just exercise more precision in identifying leftism as "leftism."

That's mystifying at least and tyrannical as well as he repeats it over and over again in abusive language so that nobody can answer him and his evil definitions stick.

Imagine how powerful I'd be if I took off my bunny slippers.

Since he's usually not called on it he gets away with it.

As opposed to being sent to bed without supper? What is this? Kindergarten?

I'm glad, frankly, that he finally was so nasty to Z and Pris that he did get told off, but there's no changing the leopard's spots.

It's true. I'm a leopard. Nothing human about me whatsoever.

Funny, he's accepted as a Christian whereas I'm in doubt because I identify heretics and explain disasters as God's judgments.

Actually you're doubted because at best, you don't know jack shit about Biblical theology yet opine on it anyway.

I'd put up with FT's off topic wanderings before I'd put up with beamish for half a second.

So skip the middleman. Go find the neo-Nazi anti-Semitic cesspools of virulent stupidity that FT copied and pasted from and linked to, and put them on your computer monitor instead of mine.

But I'm one whose posts have been treated with unchallenged abuse too so I know I'm not welcome here even though I've never been officially asked to leave. I still read this blog because some of the topics are interesting and informative -- I just avoid Ducky and beamish as much as possible.

By posting an incoherent screed to attack me?

Was your orgasm as good as the masturbation that produced it?

Dave Miller said...

Beamish said "Why is it such an issue for the Tea Party rank and file, 70% of which are disgruntled Democrats for Hillary who don't want their Medicare gravy train touched?"

and

"The majority of the Tea Party, the people who trade in Obama birth certificate conspiracy theories, ARE Democrats pissed that a black man beat Hillary Clinton for the Democratic Party nomination."

Beamish, can you provide some links that back up your these oft repeated assertion that disgruntled Democrats make up a majority of the Tea Party?

beamish said...

Dave,

It's inference from the facts that:

1.) 70% of the Tea Party doesn't want Medicare entitlements touched in budget cuts (i.e. they miss the point on America's biggest budget deficit generator, and Medicare is the quintessential Democrat pet project)

2.) The majority of the Tea Party supports Ron Paul, a politician wiith foreign policy views virtually indistinguishable from the left-most Kucinich fringes of the Democratic Party's anti-war hippie wing who believe al Qaeda was merely exercising its freedom of religion on 9/11 if they even believe al Qaeda and the CIA are not the same thing. (i.e. these are the fringe leftists that presume to give lessons at the knee in "conservatism" to Republicans)

3) The majority of the Tea Party movement has glommed onto Donald Trump, a pro-choice, anti-gun, Kelo decision-supporting, anti-free trade, tariff promoting serial bankrupt lifelong financier of Democrat left-wing politicians and causes. He is truly a poster boy of government propped-up failure and abuse of the bankruptcy system - how the F do you lose money running F'n casinos, anyway? - just stop me if and when I see his conservative credentials. I have people looking for them. I've heard they don't exist.

I've always been skeptical of the Tea Party. These are mostly people there because their party didn't pick Hillary over the black man. And their politics and stances are bearing this out.

Tea Partyers themselves will tell you that their membership is half-Democrats.

I'm merely pointing out that they're underestimating the number of Democrats among them.

Faith said...

I wasn't trying to get the last word, Z, I merely deleted the post and then thought better of it.

Yes, I watched the unfolding of the flap over FT but I didn't post because I couldn't see a way to have a useful opinion. I didn't see the situation as he saw it, however, and argued with him about it in emails --except for agreeing with him about beamish. I don't see either of you as completely in the right about all that, but I do see beamish as completely in the wrong. Just so you know.

As for apologies, there are a few times I might have expected you to email me an apology but it never happened so if I failed to apologize for something I should have, I'm sorry for that, but it works both ways. I don't call people names or attack them as some here do but you would side with an abusive attacker against me or just not say anything which implies you are siding with them, and it's very hard to let such a personal slight go on the dismissive claim that "we're all adults here" just as sue apparently found. Perhaps you are unaware of all that although that's hard to believe.

However, as I said, you have a right to run things as you wish, only don't claim that you object to uncivil treatment of people here as you only object quite selectively.

Fine. Now since the last word seems to matter despite your saying it doesn't, please have the last one.

Z said...

Faith, the last word is about pride and joylessness. I have no need to weigh in again except I've been emailed by many asking me to see how you are continuing this and that I should try to end it; many feel very badly at how I've been treated and how you are bringing up such old situations and how unkind and unwarranted it is...we get your point. You felt wronged.

Gee, so did I!! imagine? We all have feelings, but I've put a lot into this blog so there's more invested than just feeling badly..which I don't anymore. Not at all, thank the Lord for healing that!

Sue can speak for herself and does quite a job of it, too, Faith. Please lean on your own grievances and leave her out of it; that's my business.

As is my blog.
I know you're here at least 8 times a day and you know very, very well how many times I've welcomed your comments.
But Beamish hurt you months ago and this is my fault.
He's frequently over the top, I have said that over and over again and I just can't play referee; handle him yourself if you feel you must come back.

there are wonderful blogs with which to fill your time and I hope you can start new at one or more of them. thanks. I will never have bad feelings toward you because I did think you were a friend until the FT problems escalated the last time and I heard no support from you but saw you here constantly observing and not commenting...so, you see, it works both ways. You suddenly were here much more when I was getting insulted so badly.
Why you feel the need to talk to me like this is astonishing...but if it makes you feel better and you feel I won't bite back like Beamish would, you're probably right. I'm a sitting target trying to run a blog 99% of my visitors like very much...


z

FairWitness said...

Faith, Z is absolutely right. Stand up and fight your own battles with Beamish. Stop expecting Z or anyone else to take up your cause. At one time or another, you have dished out copious amounts of your own brand of sanctimonious unpleasantness at virtually everyone you converse with. I see you've learned nothing and continue to inflict your unhappiness and dissatisfaction here at GeeeeeZ.

How about this? KNOCK IT OFF! If you can't cope with the venom you yourself are responsible for eliciting, then stop posting here and anywhere else you feel abused and unappreciated. You really don't have to subject yourself to such indignities. And quite frankly, none of us deserves to be subjected to your poison, either.

beamish said...

Faith,

Does Jesus love me as much as you do?

Dave Miller said...

Beamish, not being what some conservatives call Republicans does not make someone a Democrat.

More reliable numbers seem to have the Tea Party numbers closer to 13% Democrat and 28% Independent.

Even combined, these numbers are nowhere near the majority, and do not even approach the 70% majority you claimed.

Here's the link... http://thehill.com/blogs/ballot-box/polls/90541-survey-four-in-10-tea-party-members-dem-or-indie

From where are you drawing the information about Ron Paul, Medicare, and Donald Trump supporters that you are calling facts?

Can you provide some links to back up your numbers?

Z said...

Dave...every number I've seen says 41%...right.

Dave Miller said...

Z... Quite the discussion on this thread...

Yes, about 40% is what I have seen on multiple sources...

I liked what you said about this being a conservative blog. People who regularly visit have their views and want a place to express them. Much like libs do on liberal blogs.

While I don't agree with everything said here, and comment only sporatically, I check in daily to see what you have and get the pulse of the other side of the aisle.

Keep at it... your friends really appreciate you!

Faith said...

Faith, Z is absolutely right. Stand up and fight your own battles with Beamish. Stop expecting Z or anyone else to take up your cause.

Could I please remind you all of the context of this dispute?

Some of the relevant posts have been deleted, but as I recall Z said something to the effect that it is important to her that this blog be kept civil so she deletes some uncivil posts or something like that.

Sue responded to that with something to the effect that it's simply not true that Z takes pains to protect the blog from uncivil comments as she said nothing to correct beamish when he called her, sue, some pretty abusive names.

That had also been my observation in other instances -- some incivilities are challenged, some other, often pretty extreme incivilities are tolerated, depends who is being uncivil and who is being targeted -- but I said nothig at that point. I only responded when Z came back and pretty much dismissed sue's complaint. Maybe she even told her she had to fight her own battles, we're all adults here or something like that.

In other words SOME of us are expected to fight our own battles here but others are protected by Z, and deletions by blog administrators, from nasty attacks. Some of us are told "we're all adults here" meaning deal with it yourself, but others are defended.

Obviously it's fine with you that I be left to fend for myself since my posts are "sanctimonious unpleasantness" in your judgment --fine, if that's the rules here, no problem, I'll fight my own battles and simply recognize that people who have seemed to be friends simply aren't. No problem.

But then it should not be claimed that abusive posting is not allowed here because I've certainly experienced a ton of it utterly unchallenged by Z or anyone else, and so have some others. If you're going to have a double standard, then have it openly. If you don't mind sue's being called names, or me, or FT, but you'll protect someone else from being called names, just be honest about it.

(Too long so to be continued.)

Faith said...

(concluded)

THEN: Z came back and accused me of standing back while FT insulted her, which she took as a great offense to her on my part. Unfortunately I don't remember all the ins and outs of that miserable event either, but the way I do remember it is that beamish was allowed to say unbelievably cruel nasty lying things against FT. It's one thing for Z to have her own problems with FT and not want him here, but there's something very wrong with her standing back and letting beamish tear him to shreds and never say a word against it, and then complain that I was standing back in the same way when FT had finally had it up to his ears and let loose on Z for tolerating it.

Yes he was out of line, had all sorts of paranoid ideas about how Z must have put beamish up to it and things like that, and said some horrible things against Z. However, I don't remember his saying some of the things beamish later imputed to him.

But I was still reacting to what beamish was permitted to say against FT. FT had said nothing abusive, he simply kept putting up what he considered to be evidence for his argument in favor of Ron Paul and beamish tore into him each time. "Uncivil" doesn't even come close to describing what beamish was doing.

I did not post because it's very clear that my opinions are often not welcome here so when I do post I have to be sure I'm prepared to take what I know is coming, and I'd rather not make myself a target for the incredible viciousness of beamish without a really good reason. I was not on FT's side in this dispute either, and in private I told him so -- but the way beamish was going after him I thought totally unwarranted -- ever, really, no matter what FT had done.

So. Beamish is allowed to be as vicious and insulting as he likes, but others are corrected and deleted for less than beamish gets away with. That has somewhat changed since beamish turned his viciousness against Z and Pris, but only somewhat.

In summary, Sue had simply said what I already knew to be true about the double standard, and if Z had acknowledged that I wouldn't have said anything, but instead she pretty much put down Sue for stating the truth and I was foolish enough to jump in at that point.

So "Fair" Witness, I'm quite happy to take my chances when I post here, but don't tell me this blog is careful to protect people from incivilities when that's only very selectively true. Again, the context is the double standard -- that was Sue's point and I'm echoing it -- not my own personal grievances, which only came up because the double standard was getting ignored.

Cheers.

FairWitness said...

Faith, for the love of God, open your mind to something. I'm trying to help you. You are expecting someone who has been attacked by you and your friends to defend you against other posters who do not attack her. You are eliciting this ill will directed at you because you mistreat people in a sanctimonious, unpleasant manner. You have made folks angry at you by your condescension and superiority, "Lording Over" everyone. You want friends to care for you, BE A FRIEND YOURSELF!

You are not going to see any improvements in your friendships with anybody so long as you continue to play the victim all the while victimizing others. You are guilty of the same rudeness and ill treatment you are complaining about.

And one more thing to everyone: Mrs. Z is STILL in mourning. She has enough to deal with just getting up and facing each day with the heavy burden of a broken heart. Everyone, including ME, needs to treat her with the respect and deference she deserves. What she's going through is one of life's most horrific losses and she will need our care and consideration for many more months and years to come. Please keep it in mind when you blast everyone on her blog that this brave woman, whom we all admire and care for so very much, has enough pain and heartache without us adding to it.

Dave Miller said...

Faith, I do not know you from Adam and have no idea what your history is with Z.

But let's be real, this is her blog, and if you do not like the seeming, or even real inconsistencies, you are free to go elsewhere.

That is just the way it is.

Look, Beamish is how he is. So what?

It is still your decision to come here and either stay and comment, or not. But it is not your place to tell a blogger how to run their site.

Bottom line, if you do not like a particular site, you are more than welcome to go elsewhere.

But for the love, get off Z's back.

Jen said...

What she's going through is one of life's most horrific losses and she will need our care and consideration for many more months and years to come. Please keep it in mind when you blast everyone on her blog that this brave woman, whom we all admire and care for so very much, has enough pain and heartache without us adding to it.

------------

Excellent point, FairWitness, and thank you so much for pointing that out!

Now if people could only internalize it.

Z said...

Dave, thanks very much. Whatever you've said here from the left or the right side of on any subject, I've appreciated your civility and intelligence.

Faith, why is this so important to you? Is it SO important to make sure my readers know I treated so terribly you and whoever else you feel has been slighted? Are you bent on CONVINCING Fair Witness and others how ROTTEN I am and how wrong they are? WHY?

I just wrote REAMS here to you, but what's the point? I deleted it...but this is really reaching the limit.

Are you through, Faith? You've become FT and I will NOT have what happened at FPM because of him happen here, bet on that, okay? Why keep punching until everyone agrees with you? That's not life, it's not blogging, it's impossible..
I've tried not to be as unkind as you have but I'm truly sick of this and I hate your embarrassing yourself now.

go ahead and delete your comments now......leave with some dignity.

Thank you, FW, Dave and Jen; I'm sorry you've had to take this time but it's very appreciated. Faith wrote me an email in which she accused you all of coddling me, basically... Perhaps that's so; I'm proud of that and appreciative it more than you could know.
I am still grieving Mr. Z's death but have tried not to use that to explain any behavior some might not find pleasant; I just find it odd that it's this time in my life I'm the most attacked.

FairWitness said...

My dearest Z, you do have friends who respect you and care very deeply about your well-being. Please try to ignore Faith's attempts to turn that regard and love into something untoward. It is anything but! She is a vicious, miserable, lonely wretch who will not learn that she has only herself to blame for her misery.

You have NOTHING to apologize to anyone for. You are owed the apologies, my dear lady. I, myself, have done so on numerous occasions and you, being the exemplary woman you are, were gracious and kind and forgiving. You are such an inspiration to me, Mrs. Z. Thank you for being who you are and being my forgiving, loving friend.

Faith is jealous of the role you've earned. She can't possibly aspire to where you are, so she thinks she can get there by trying to diminish you.

The thing she doesn't seem to understand is that she cannot do anything to diminish you. She had nothing to do with what made you such a success. You did that, it's your accomplishment. No one can take that away from you. Ir'a yours, my dear friend.

I'm sorry you must endure this crap while you're still hurting so very much from the loss of Mr. Z. I truly wish I could take that pain away. Alas, I cannot.... but know that I understand and am here to support you.

Faith, stop all your nasty messages, public AND private. You will not make yourself feel better or improve your lot in life by trying to hurt one of God's children. Leave Mrs. Z alone if you can't treat her with the respect and care she deserves.

beamish said...

Faith,

You're failing to mention that your beloved neo-Nazi FT was asked by Z to depart and not post here, a request he ignored and persisted in pestering Z both on her blog (and apparently in email too) for well over 4 months and even calling her some pretty vile things throughout it all.

I didn't make FT unwelcome here, he made himself unwelcome.

Z is a very good friend of mine. You might even say I'm a lifetime member of her fan club. I too know Z is just trying to run an enjoyable blog and her connection to us all is genuine. Her friends love her.

Personally, I let FT's snide racist remarks and copy-and-pastes from racism central go unchallenged for months until Z asked him to go, and he made the dire mistake of not doing so.

Speaking of myself personally, you're either my friend, or you're not worth pissing on when you're on fire. FT was messing with my friend. I helped Z make some subtle changes to her blog settings to keep the riff-raff out. Hopefully they'll hold, by my technical advice is far from exhausted.

Z will have a successful blog forum in spite of assholes trying to tear it down. That's how we roll.

The last thing Z needs is bullying continuous harassment from those asked to depart. FT had to go.

It's a shame he wouldn't go quietly.

If ever Z wishes me to not post here, you'll never see me post here again.

That's the difference.

beamish said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
beamish said...

Dave,

From where are you drawing the information about Ron Paul, Medicare, and Donald Trump supporters that you are calling facts?

Can you provide some links to back up your numbers?



70% of Tea Party opposes cuts to Medicare

Ron Paul gets most votes in Tea Party national summit straw poll

Donald Trump is favorite among self-identified Tea Partiers

The picture's pretty clear to me. If the Tea Party was a conservative movement, it stopped being one in the last six months.

70% opposition to cutting Medicare? Ron "let's extend the recession on the gold standard" Paul? Donald "I can go bankrupt four times running casinos" Trump?

These are the prevailing sentiments of a "conservative" movement?

Really?

Z said...

FW, thanks very much.
This got way out of control and brought out things none of us likes to expose, that's for sure.
You highly overrate me, by the way (I LIKE THAT :-)!!
xx thanks.

Beamish...thanks, buddy.
I don't know quite what else to say.
xxx

beamish said...

I've posted a reply to Dave with the links he wanted and it's disappeared three times.

beamish said...

70% of Tea Party opposes Medicare cuts

Ron Paul recieves most votes in Tea Party summit straw poll

Majority of Tea Partiers favor Donald Trump over other candidates

The numbers speak for themselves.

Tea Partiers aren't serious about reining in the poster child of debt-creating big government programs, and aren't seeking a conservative Presidential candidate.

If the Tea Party was a conservative movement, it stopped being one around six months ago.

And it likely has something to do with the number of Democrats within it.

1% Democrat is 1% too much, IMHO.

Z said...

it must be the blog god, beamish; i wanted to delete it because I'm tired of the TEA PARTY IS A BUNCH OF LIBS stuff and didn't.......
3 times, huh? :-)
God is so good.

heh heh
But, seriously (not that I'm not serious about the TP and lib thing, and PLEASE don't go into it again..I get it, TRUST ME :-)...but, seriously, as I was saying, why do only some comments disappear? SAM and you are the only two who I think it happens to...Sam had it very frequently. Could it be too many links in the comment??? I don't get it.

beamish said...

Beamish...thanks, buddy.
I don't know quite what else to say.


Don't gotta say nothin'. Nobody is owed an explanation about why you don't tolerate boorish assclowns like FT.

Me, I figure "because he's a boorish assclown" is explanation enough, but I grew out of asking why about the obvious all the time when I was four.

If you've got double standards, well shit, that's twice as many as most people.

You have to defend your decision to remove a racist pustule of a cretin? Really?

beamish said...

Too many links... hmm could be.

Damn copyright fairies.

beamish said...

it must be the blog god, beamish; i wanted to delete it because I'm tired of the TEA PARTY IS A BUNCH OF LIBS stuff and didn't.......
3 times, huh? :-)
God is so good.

heh heh


You stinker :P

Tell ya what Z...

If the Tea Party starts pushing for punitive airstrikes upon Pakistan for the crime of being Pakistani on our planet without a license, er, for harboring Osama Bin Laden on their soil, I might perk up and listen to them again.

I just don't see that happening.

And let's face it, Obama's going to get the credit for Dick Cheney's brainchild, the JSOC units that took down Bin Laden.

American special operations forces have had Osama Bin Laden one gunshot away from Hell five times, four times under Clinton. Obama gave authorization to kill or if necessary capture Bin Laden when the intel was hot and the shooters were in place. For that, Obama deserves credit and I'm willing to give it. If the operation had gone wrong, lots of valuable time and the treasure trove of intel to be exploited from Bin Laden's Chateau D'Merde would be forever lost. Obama made a gamble, and it paid off. Good on him for that.

I'm still not going to vote for him unless the other choice is equally or more stupid.

The military doesn't need a search warrant to exploit Osama Bin Laden's computer files. That's what it's all about.

I still haven't forgotten this administration put Navy SEALs on trial for punching a terrorist.

Faith said...

My latest post was an even-toned attempt to clear up a confusion, nothing more, although it seems to have occasioned a barrage of nasty ad hominems and a mountain of emotionally-charged irrelevancy. Oh well, so much for a civil blog.

One more attempt to clear something up:

I was not defending FT. That's between him and Z. What I was objecting to is the abusive rants against him, which NOBODY deserves, NOBODY -- and if you want a civil blog you should not allow that sort of thing from anyone ever. If FT is not welcome, DELETE HIM, for pete's sake, just delete him without comment. There is NO defense for what beamish did, NONE WHATEVER.

Oh, and I might add that Jesus said something to the effect that if you love those who love you what credit do you have? Even publicans and sinners do the same.

I don't know if I'll check back for the next rant or not but I do hope I'll eventually stop coming here. I do like this blog in many ways. Too bad it has certain problems that nobody wants to acknowledge.

beamish said...

Oh, and I might add that Jesus said something to the effect that if you love those who love you what credit do you have? Even publicans and sinners do the same.

Good thing you're no publican or sinner, huh Faith?

Look, seriously, with all due respect, if the way I treated an unwelcome, uninvited, pestering, serial racist website copying and pasting neo-Nazi shitbag like FT offended you, then frankly, go screw yourself if I don't offend you.

What is it about you neo-Nazis anyway? Just about every regular poster and reader here knows the history of the troubles FT brought to Z's blog. Who are you trying to score points for in your petty misfired attempts at revising history? Yourself?

So you hate me. Can't stand me. Drama of the century.

You're out of gas. Not tall enough for this ride.

Go be civil up your ass, dipshit.

Z said...

Beamish...."Chateau de Merde" :-)
By the way, your comment sounds scarily like you think I approve of Obama in ANY WAY? ...huh?

Pris said...

"If the Tea Party was a conservative movement, it stopped being one around six months ago."

Beamish, let me break this to you as gently as I can. There is no one tea party group, tea party leader, and no representative who speaks for the thousands of tea parties around the country.

I belong to two groups. One we just joined, the other we belong to from the beginninng. We've never taken a poll, or participated in one. We don't endorse any candidate. Not now.

At our convention the speakers were conservative local candidates. The tea parties are all independent and are concerned with conservative issues, fiscal issues.

You can cite a poll from one tea party group all you want. It doesn't represent all groups, only itself.

The media shouldn't present any poll from one TP group and pass it off as though it's the entire movement. It is not.

I haven't met a liberal yet at our functions. The last convention which we weren't able to attend had Sharon Angle as a guest speaker.

The one before this one had Star Parker and other local conservative candidates, who spoke.
That was before the Nov. election.

So, everything you say is rather off the wall, given my experience. you exaggerate, and condemn something you know little about.

beamish said...

Z,

I don't think you approve of Obama at all.

I don't either.

I just know the risks that went into deciding to take out Bin Laden, and I'm glad Obama found his balls, and so I'm willing to give him a kudo for that.

beamish said...

Beamish, let me break this to you as gently as I can. There is no one tea party group, tea party leader, and no representative who speaks for the thousands of tea parties around the country.

Then let me break to you as gently to you as I can. There is no one Tea Party group that put Republicans in charge of the House in the 2010 elections, and there is no one Tea Party group that has a plausible shot at "taking over" the Republican Party.

You can't "plausibly deny" away the fact that the Tea Party movement, as a whole, is a joke.

FairWitness said...

Faith.... you are guilty of the very charge you make against the rest of us. Have you comprehended nothing of what we've said?

This blog belongs to Mrs. Z. It is her prerogative to deal with disruptive, abusive posters as she sees fit. That is her right. You have no right or any invitation to critique or dictate how she runs her blog.

Beamish expresses his outrage and ire in very strong terms. He's doing so in defense of Mrs. Z. Why you expect Mrs. Z to stop him is, quite frankly, insane.

You chose to defend FT, whose destructive & unacceptable behavior is well-known and ongoing for more than a decade now. Faith, honestly, how can you defend the indefensible? You skim over the fact that you told FT in private that you didn't approve. Not good enough! Because you also spent the same time trying to attack Mrs. Z & Beamish, PUBLICLY on this blog.

If you want to run things, START YOUR OWN BLOG! This blog is Mrs. Z's. You are attempting to assume rights you don't have!

What is so hard for you to understand? You think because Beamish uses strong language when he takes on you, FT or anyone else that it invalidates his message??? It does not.

And not ONE WORD OF ACKNOWLEDGEMENT from you that you received the message that you are causing additional stress and pain to the purveyor of this blog. You owe Mrs. Z an enormous apology. If you can't do that, if you can't resist any further pissing and moaning about erroneous, nonexistent personal slights and insults, JUST leave here and don't come back.

Z said...

beamish, my comments on the post about the 'get' said exactly that.
I give him credit, I thought his speech wasn't too bad, either...
your comment here sounded like you thought I'd forgotten how generally rotten the guy is.
that's why I had to write what I did...geeez

Z said...

FW, thanks, but I'm hoping Faith is gone now....
I really appreciate your support.xxx

Faith said...

What is so hard for you to understand? You think because Beamish uses strong language when he takes on you, FT or anyone else that it invalidates his message??? It does not.

No, it invalidates the claim that great effort is taken to ensure this blog is civil.

No point in addressing any of the rest of the amazing distortions of a simple message.

I'm gone, Z.

Z said...

I doubt that, Faith, but I do wish you all the best

beamish said...

Z,

I gave a kudo to Obama, not kudo(s), plural.

;)

beamish said...

Beamish expresses his outrage and ire in very strong terms. He's doing so in defense of Mrs. Z. Why you expect Mrs. Z to stop him is, quite frankly, insane.

Besides, Faith never said pretty please.